twitter: rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 10 topics

rec.crafts.metalworking
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Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT-Social Security $28 billion in the hole
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/5e543d07a3e16308?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 8 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:16 pm
From: "azotic"

"John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
news:AL-dnfxDdfZHIfHWnZ2dnUVZ_sidnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
> My Mom and I are watching Beck every evening. It's becoming a sort of past
> time.
> She actually records his and Smith's daily broadcasts so we can watch it
> together.
> LOL
> A couple of days ago Beck displayed and then explained his "Debt Clock".
> He got a bunch of stuff right and then at the end added that the US had an
> unfunded liability of $75 Trillion dollars.
> Yep, you guessed it - Social Security. I paused the playback and explained
> how rediculous this was and also that it just isn't, and couldn't be,
> true.
> She got it right away, especially the part about either raising taxes or
> reducing benefits to correct any imbalance.
>
> OK, she's an MLS from Michigan State but if a woman in her 80's suffering
> from the early symptoms of either senile dementia or Ahlziemer'scan wrap
> her
> head around the actual truth, anyone ought to be able to do the same.
> Apparently, Glenn Beck, Wes and a huge percentage of the population are
> unable to be as rational as my 80 something mother.
>
> --
> John R. Carroll
>

Just curious, did beck explain how he came up with $75 trillion dollars ?

Best Regards
Tom.

== 2 of 8 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:29 pm
From: "John R. Carroll"

azotic wrote:
> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
> news:AL-dnfxDdfZHIfHWnZ2dnUVZ_sidnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>
>> My Mom and I are watching Beck every evening. It's becoming a sort
>> of past time.
>> She actually records his and Smith's daily broadcasts so we can
>> watch it together.
>> LOL
>> A couple of days ago Beck displayed and then explained his "Debt
>> Clock". He got a bunch of stuff right and then at the end added that
>> the US had an unfunded liability of $75 Trillion dollars.
>> Yep, you guessed it - Social Security. I paused the playback and
>> explained how rediculous this was and also that it just isn't, and
>> couldn't be, true.
>> She got it right away, especially the part about either raising
>> taxes or reducing benefits to correct any imbalance.
>>
>> OK, she's an MLS from Michigan State but if a woman in her 80's
>> suffering from the early symptoms of either senile dementia or
>> Ahlziemer'scan wrap her
>> head around the actual truth, anyone ought to be able to do the same.
>> Apparently, Glenn Beck, Wes and a huge percentage of the population
>> are unable to be as rational as my 80 something mother.
>>
>> --
>> John R. Carroll
>>
>
> Just curious, did beck explain how he came up with $75 trillion
> dollars ?

No.
He just attributed the shortfall to the unfunded portion of SS obligations.
The truth is that SS is funded in real time and he must certainly know that.

The excess beyond that amount can only be used to do one thing - buy
T-Bills.
The reasoning was to prevent the distortion of markets while hedging
against inflation and to do so with risk limited to the maximum extent
possible.

The issue is completely separate from deficit spending or deficits at all
for that matter.

--
John R. Carroll

== 3 of 8 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:41 pm
From: "Ed Huntress"

"John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
news:AL-dnfxDdfZHIfHWnZ2dnUVZ_sidnZ2d@giganews.com...
> Ed Huntress wrote:
>> "Wes" <clutch@lycos.com> wrote in message
>> news:hkicg7$15h$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>> "Ed Huntress" <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> But there never was any place to *store* the money. Everyone knew
>>>> from the start that this is how it would work. That's why many of
>>>> us laugh when we hear about the "trust fund."
>>>>
>>>
>>> And some of us are outraged that our federal government
>>> misrepresented how FICA was used
>>> to finance a government that had un-sound financial policies.
>>>
>>> I'm only p*ss*ed, I knew the screw was on for a long, long time.
>>>
>>> Wes
>>
>> With all due respect, Wes, they never hid how it works. People just
>> didn't pay attention. This was all thoroughly explained and vetted
>> back in the '80s, when Greenspan was selling an increase in the FICA
>> rate to Congress.
>>
>> This is a complicated government. Its finances work astoundingly
>> well, and it's not at all hard to understand the basics. But most
>> people don't bother to look into it, and wind up being suspicious and
>> paranoid about the whole thing.
>>
>> There are so many cheap-shot ways to criticize it that Congress
>> generally keeps pretty quiet about it. But they don't hide it. That's
>> unfortunate in several ways, one of which we're paying for now: it's
>> given the Tea Partiers a whole string of cheap-shot arguments.
>>
>> I'm sure that most of them don't know how it all works. And they're
>> counting on most of the country not knowing how it works. That's how
>> they get people worked up and angry -- by selling them a bunch of
>> baloney, playing on their suspicions and their lack of understanding.
>> That's what creates paranoia.
>
> My Mom and I are watching Beck every evening. It's becoming a sort of past
> time.
> She actually records his and Smith's daily broadcasts so we can watch it
> together.
> LOL

Now, THAT's entertainment. <g>

> A couple of days ago Beck displayed and then explained his "Debt Clock".
> He got a bunch of stuff right and then at the end added that the US had an
> unfunded liability of $75 Trillion dollars.
> Yep, you guessed it - Social Security. I paused the playback and explained
> how rediculous this was and also that it just isn't, and couldn't be,
> true.
> She got it right away, especially the part about either raising taxes or
> reducing benefits to correct any imbalance.

Your mom, as you've described her, is smart. Most people are plenty smart
enough to get it. But they get their information from people with an agenda,
who play on the fact that studying balance sheets isn't fun for anyone, so
hardly anyone does it.

That "Turkeys Voting for Christmas" piece was one of the most depressing
things I've heard lately. But I don't blame people for not looking into
these things for themselves. Many of them have become so complicated, as has
the world. That makes us vulnerable to the polemicists -- even the fairly
ignorant and transparent ones, like Beck.

>
> OK, she's an MLS from Michigan State but if a woman in her 80's suffering
> from the early symptoms of either senile dementia or Ahlziemer'scan wrap
> her
> head around the actual truth, anyone ought to be able to do the same.

They should, and they can. But they don't.

> Apparently, Glenn Beck, Wes and a huge percentage of the population are
> unable to be as rational as my 80 something mother.

Beck has a shtick that makes him a lot of money. Wes has a full-time job.
But Wes watches C-Span, which I can rarely bring myself to do. What seems to
get lost is the background and perspective. It requires quite a bit of
study.

For example, if you talk to someone who thinks that our national debt is
insurmountable, at 83% of GDP, and explain to them that it was 120% of GDP
after WWII and was followed by two decades of high average growth, they look
immediately for a reason this couldn't be true, rather than trying to figure
out why it IS true.

--
Ed Huntress

== 4 of 8 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:56 pm
From: Too_Many_Tools

On Feb 5, 3:33 pm, Ignoramus17710 <ignoramus17...@NOSPAM.
17710.invalid> wrote:
> On 2010-02-05, azotic <azo...@cox.net> wrote:
>
> > A report from the Congressional Budget Office shows that for the first time
> > in 25 years, Social Security is taking in less in taxes than it is spending
> > on benefits.Instead of helping to finance the rest of the government, as it
> > has done for decades, our nation's biggest social program needs help from
> > the Treasury to keep benefit checks from bouncing -- in other words, a
> > taxpayer bailout.
>
> > Social Security will be $28 billion in the hole this fiscal year, which ends
> > Sept. 30.
>
> >http://money.cnn.com/2010/02/02/news/economy/social_security_bailout....
>
> > Exporting jobs finally shows results...............
>
> Tom, Republicans were always in support of "free trade", which is
> associated with exporting jobs.
>
> I also support "free trade", by the way, even though I voted for
> Obama.
>
> The reality is that, given our free trade treaty obligations and the
> capitalist system, there is very little that we can do to prevent jobs
> going to the lowest suitable builder.
>
> So some impoverished villagers in India bid $3/day to make cheap vises
> and poison their own environment, and guess what, that's where the job
> goes and we cannot do much about it.
>
> Those villagers cannot bid $3/day to build airplanes, so these jobs
> still stay in the US.
>
> It is not free trade that causes our problems, it is excessive
> borrowing.
>
> i

Not yet that is.

China is working very hard to become a viable airplane exporter.

In the future you will be driving a Chinese car.

And flying in a Chinese airplane.

TMT

== 5 of 8 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:13 pm
From: Too_Many_Tools

On Feb 5, 6:35 pm, "Ed Huntress" <huntre...@optonline.net> wrote:
> "Wes" <clu...@lycos.com> wrote in message
>
> news:hkicg7$15h$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> > "Ed Huntress" <huntre...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> >>But there never was any place to *store* the money. Everyone knew from the
> >>start that this is how it would work. That's why many of us laugh when we
> >>hear about the "trust fund."
>
> > And some of us are outraged that our federal government misrepresented how
> > FICA was used
> > to finance a government that had un-sound financial policies.
>
> > I'm only p*ss*ed, I knew the screw was on for a long, long time.
>
> > Wes
>
> With all due respect, Wes, they never hid how it works. People just didn't
> pay attention. This was all thoroughly explained and vetted back in the
> '80s, when Greenspan was selling an increase in the FICA rate to Congress.
>
> This is a complicated government. Its finances work astoundingly well, and
> it's not at all hard to understand the basics. But most people don't bother
> to look into it, and wind up being suspicious and paranoid about the whole
> thing.
>
> There are so many cheap-shot ways to criticize it that Congress generally
> keeps pretty quiet about it. But they don't hide it. That's unfortunate in
> several ways, one of which we're paying for now: it's given the Tea Partiers
> a whole string of cheap-shot arguments.
>
> I'm sure that most of them don't know how it all works. And they're counting
> on most of the country not knowing how it works. That's how they get people
> worked up and angry -- by selling them a bunch of baloney, playing on their
> suspicions and their lack of understanding. That's what creates paranoia.
>
> --
> Ed Huntress

Hey Ed...did you hear less than 600 people have shown up for the Tea
Party National Convention.

I wonder how many came for the free T-shirt?

TMT

== 6 of 8 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:15 pm
From: Too_Many_Tools

On Feb 5, 6:49 pm, "John R. Carroll" <nu...@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:
> Ed Huntress wrote:
> > "Wes" <clu...@lycos.com> wrote in message
> >news:hkicg7$15h$1@news.eternal-september.org...
> >> "Ed Huntress" <huntre...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> >>> But there never was any place to *store* the money. Everyone knew
> >>> from the start that this is how it would work. That's why many of
> >>> us laugh when we hear about the "trust fund."
>
> >> And some of us are outraged that our federal government
> >> misrepresented how FICA was used
> >> to finance a government that had un-sound financial policies.
>
> >> I'm only p*ss*ed, I knew the screw was on for a long, long time.
>
> >> Wes
>
> > With all due respect, Wes, they never hid how it works. People just
> > didn't pay attention. This was all thoroughly explained and vetted
> > back in the '80s, when Greenspan was selling an increase in the FICA
> > rate to Congress.
>
> > This is a complicated government. Its finances work astoundingly
> > well, and it's not at all hard to understand the basics. But most
> > people don't bother to look into it, and wind up being suspicious and
> > paranoid about the whole thing.
>
> > There are so many cheap-shot ways to criticize it that Congress
> > generally keeps pretty quiet about it. But they don't hide it. That's
> > unfortunate in several ways, one of which we're paying for now: it's
> > given the Tea Partiers a whole string of cheap-shot arguments.
>
> > I'm sure that most of them don't know how it all works. And they're
> > counting on most of the country not knowing how it works. That's how
> > they get people worked up and angry -- by selling them a bunch of
> > baloney, playing on their suspicions and their lack of understanding.
> > That's what creates paranoia.
>
> My Mom and I are watching Beck every evening. It's becoming a sort of past
> time.
> She actually records his and Smith's daily broadcasts so we can watch it
> together.
> LOL
> A couple of days ago Beck displayed and then explained his "Debt Clock".
> He got a bunch of stuff right and then at the end added that the US had an
> unfunded liability of $75 Trillion dollars.
> Yep, you guessed it - Social Security. I paused the playback and explained
> how rediculous this was and also that it just isn't, and couldn't be, true.
> She got it right away, especially the part about either raising taxes or
> reducing benefits to correct any imbalance.
>
> OK, she's an MLS from Michigan State but if a woman in her 80's suffering
> from the early symptoms of either senile dementia or Ahlziemer'scan wrap her
> head around the actual truth, anyone ought to be able to do the same.
> Apparently, Glenn Beck, Wes and a huge percentage of the population are
> unable to be as rational as my 80 something mother.
>
> --
> John R. Carroll- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Good luck with your mom.

It sounds like she has a good son.

TMT

== 7 of 8 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:26 pm
From: "pdrahn@coinet.com"

On Feb 5, 4:31 pm, "John R. Carroll" <nu...@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:

>
> Yeah, it isn't even a drawer.
> Somewhere on a computer there is a file recording movement od dollars from
> column A to column B and back again.
>
> --
> John R. Carroll

You are absolutely correct, John. The FICA money goes directly to the
US Treasury via the IRS. Not a penny goes to the SSA. On the other
side, the SSA does not disburse a single penny. They tell the US
Treasury to disburse so much money to some recipient. All the SSA does
is keep records and print reports.

The FICA money used to purchase Treasury Notes is just a book keeping
system and nothing more, since Treasury also issues/sells the notes.
No money ever changes hands in the transaction, just changes account
numbers.

Paul

== 8 of 8 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:26 pm
From: F. George McDuffee

On Fri, 5 Feb 2010 19:16:15 -0600, "William Wixon"
<wwixon@frontiernet.net> wrote:
<snip a bunch of good stuff>
>> The issue is the net effect, in terms of jobs, types of jobs, and incomes
>> going both ways.
>>
>> --
>> Ed Huntress
>>
>
>you saying that ed makes me wonder if ANYBODY knows, if this is yet another
>massive uncontrolled experiment. they were just going on ideology when they
>started this instead of having any idea how it was going to turn out.
<snip more good stuff>
========
Currently we [the U.S.] are importing about 1.52$US for every
1.00$US we export according to the Treasury department numbers,
however book cooking through "transfer pricing" and other tax
evasion scams by the transnational corporations may have
significantly distorted this data.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_United_States

Imports $1.570 trillion c.i.f. (2009)
Exports $1.035 trillion f.o.b. (2009)
===============================
$0.535 trillion deficit
or about $1.52 in imports for every $1.00 of exports.

The largest single import commodity by dollar volume remains
petroleum and petroleum products, however a major concern is that
the U.S. products imported tend to be high labor content/high
value added such as consumer electronics, automotive vehicles and
textiles/shoes while the exports tend to be very low labor
content/very low value added products such as raw agricultural
products, scrap iron, and waste paper.
http://www.ustr.gov/sites/default/files/uploads/reports/2008/asset_upload_file595_14552.pdf

This distribution of import and export products is a disaster
because the import products tend to be in high economic
multiplier sectors while the export products appear to be in the
low economic multiplier sectors, thus the aggrigate economic
impact is far worse than the 1:1.52 ratio would indicate.

From a state and local tax basis this is also a bad situation as
the taxes possible to collect from agricultural land/operations
are minimal compared to the taxes paid by large manufacturing
enterprises, and the consequential tax revenue generated through
the employee income and sales taxes.

One area of question is the assumption that somehow "government"
and/or "business" are monolithic. This does not appear to be the
case, rather shared interests tend to move everyone in the group
in the same direction.

What you describe as an experiment does not in fact appear to be
one, but rather the combined result/outcome of a more-or-less
independent group of transnational companies, including banks and
financial services, maximizing their short term profits through
what ever means available, including changes in the regulatory
environment through political influence. This should not be
considered any type of moral judgement as this is just what
business does.

Note that in many cases, these [import] profits were "skimmed,"
through excessive executive compensation, bonuses, stock options,
etc. and were never distributed to the real owners
[stockholders]. In other cases these profits have been placed
outside U.S. [tax] jurisdiction through transfer pricing and are
beyond tracking.

While the immense scale is new, the situation is not. One
example on a smaller scale is commercial fishing, where entire
species have been repeatedly wiped out and fisheries collapsed
because of greed and over fishing for short run profit. Thus the
problem appears to be a long-standing one dating back millennia,
requiring a mental health professional and not an economist...

Unka George (George McDuffee)
..............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

==============================================================================
TOPIC: A new "constitutional right"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8e77e80070fe5b42?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:21 pm
From: Beam Me Up Scotty

On 2/5/2010 4:48 AM, Cliff wrote:
> On Tue, 02 Feb 2010 10:28:14 -0500, Beam Me Up Scotty
> <Then-Destroy-Everything@Talk-n-dog.com> wrote:
>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs

>
> "The URL contained a malformed video ID. "

The double dash at the end was actually the signature identifier....
like the one below.
--

==============================================================================
TOPIC: hi temp zip tie
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/6681ce4cb9ca953d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:37 pm
From: "Bill Noble"

it doesn't take long to identify a wide range of suitable adhesives that
claim strength to 600 deg F - why are you using zip ties?

"Karl Townsend" <karltownsend.NOT@embarqmail.com> wrote in message
news:4b6bbf2b$0$77543$892e0abb@auth.newsreader.octanews.com...
> I'm still thinking on how to mount a temp sensor to a solar hot water
> heater. I plan to put the sensor wire inside a 1/2" flexible copper pipe
> and bring it along side the hot exit water pipe on the solar heater. Need
> to attach this to withstand a small hurricane (hopefully) and the hot
> Florida sun. Plan "A" was just electrical zip ties for both sensor and
> copper conduit. Will these take the heat? Got a better idea?
>
> http://www.mcmaster.com/#1760k77/=5oipt5
>

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Home of the Free, the Brave and the Gay
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/e498f6bd3200ff6e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:47 pm
From: tankfixer

In article <2d570b79-dd2d-4707-8a2e-b18e1b256362
@b10g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>, too_many_tools@yahoo.com says...
>
> On Feb 3, 11:53 pm, tankfixer <paul.carr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > In article <b7a5d4f6-1ca1-4167-bfc1-
> > 5c83d77af...@a5g2000yqi.googlegroups.com>, too_many_to...@yahoo.com
> > says...
> >
> > > Both homo and hetrosexuality are normal...check the science.
> >
> > Last time I checked a hetrosexual couple can reporduce by having sex..
> > A homosexual couple cannot..
> >
> > Do you think it normal a species would evolve in such a manner as to not
> > be able to reproduce itself ?
>
> When was the military's mission reproduction of the species?

Never seen a ships crew after a 6 months at sea have you ?

> Please stay on topic.

Please go pound sand

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:48 pm
From: tankfixer

In article <Xns9D16783E5B805hopewell@216.196.97.130>, "RD (The
Sandman)" says...
>
> Beam Me Up Scotty <Then-Destroy-Everything@Talk-n-dog.com> wrote in
> news:4b6c496f$0$6035$ec3e2dad@unlimited.usenetmonster.com:
>
> > On 2/5/2010 12:24 AM, Too_Many_Tools wrote:
> >> On Feb 3, 11:53 pm, tankfixer <paul.carr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> In article <b7a5d4f6-1ca1-4167-bfc1-
> >>> 5c83d77af...@a5g2000yqi.googlegroups.com>, too_many_to...@yahoo.com
> >>> says...
> >>>
> >>>> Both homo and hetrosexuality are normal...check the science.
> >>>
> >>> Last time I checked a hetrosexual couple can reporduce by having
> >>> sex.. A homosexual couple cannot..
> >>>
> >>> Do you think it normal a species would evolve in such a manner as to
> >>> not be able to reproduce itself ?
> >>
> >> When was the military's mission reproduction of the species?
> >>
> >> Please stay on topic.
> >>
> >> TMT
> >
> >
> > *So the military has a mission* , and you say that mission is more
> > important than social functions like reproduction?
> >
> > Doesn't that mean that anything including making Gays happy, and
> > reproduction of heterosexuals are NOT the mission and therefore the
> > Military is not obliged to make any special social allowances for
> > reproduction sexual behavior or NON reproductive sexual behavior that
> > would in any way disrupt or impede any part of the MISSION of keeping
> > America safe.
> >
> > If the DNR and the EPA and other Government agencies are willing to
> > take years to do a study an owl or a rat to secure their safety and
> > then ban any improvement that would risk the goal of their
> > reproduction and survival.... then we deserve at least the same
> > consideration before you force the MILITARY to allow GAYS and GAY
> > marriages, and Gay sex in the Barracks, and GAY parades, in the
> > military.
>
> Gays have been in the military for decades. Hell I was in the military
> in the 50s and early 60s, gays were there. We mostly didn't give a damn
> as long as they could cover our six. If they could do that and shoot
> straight, we didn't care if they were green, black, white, hetero or
> homo. We did joke about the "Velvet Club" but as long as it stayed to
> itself, no problem. Kind of an informal "Don't ask, don't tell",
> although we always had a pretty good idea who was a member and who
> wasn't.

Pretty much how it works nowdays.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:51 pm
From: tankfixer

In article <0m7nm513shf5m1krh6012qdvfivp2plu54@4ax.com>,
mrLookout@yahoo.com says...
>
> On Thu, 4 Feb 2010 19:00:59 -0800, tankfixer <paul.carrier@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >In article <Xns9D1590CC9BE1Fhopewell@216.196.97.130>, "RD (The
> >Sandman)" says...
> >>
> >> tankfixer <paul.carrier@gmail.com> wrote in news:MPG.25d400b64cea72b7fb0
> >> @news.bytemine.net:
> >>
> >> > In article <b7a5d4f6-1ca1-4167-bfc1-
> >> > 5c83d77af1dc@a5g2000yqi.googlegroups.com>, too_many_tools@yahoo.com
> >> > says...
> >> >> Both homo and hetrosexuality are normal...check the science.
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > Last time I checked a hetrosexual couple can reporduce by having sex..
> >> > A homosexual couple cannot..
> >> >
> >> > Do you think it normal a species would evolve in such a manner as to
> >> not
> >> > be able to reproduce itself ?
> >> >
> >>
> >> Be careful there, Tank. Many species indulge in homosexual behaviour.
> >> Not for procreation of course, but they do indulge.
> >
> >Pleasure wasn't the issue..
> >Furthering the species is.
>
> Nope. That's a useless inclusion in the debate. It means nothing.

It only means you won't be having kids..

> >
> >I can care less what people do for fun but don't try to convince me it's
> >"normal"
>
> No one will convince you because you're too stupid to figure it out.

I thought you were ignoring me..
Another of your lies ?

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:52 pm
From: tankfixer

In article <Xns9D16641758969hopewell@216.196.97.130>, "RD (The
Sandman)" says...
>
> tankfixer <paul.carrier@gmail.com> wrote in news:MPG.25d529c77a07b30bfb7
> @news.bytemine.net:
>
> > In article <Xns9D1590CC9BE1Fhopewell@216.196.97.130>, "RD (The
> > Sandman)" says...
> >>
> >> tankfixer <paul.carrier@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:MPG.25d400b64cea72b7fb0
> >> @news.bytemine.net:
> >>
> >> > In article <b7a5d4f6-1ca1-4167-bfc1-
> >> > 5c83d77af1dc@a5g2000yqi.googlegroups.com>, too_many_tools@yahoo.com
> >> > says...
> >> >> Both homo and hetrosexuality are normal...check the science.
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > Last time I checked a hetrosexual couple can reporduce by having
> sex..
> >> > A homosexual couple cannot..
> >> >
> >> > Do you think it normal a species would evolve in such a manner as to
> >> not
> >> > be able to reproduce itself ?
> >> >
> >>
> >> Be careful there, Tank. Many species indulge in homosexual behaviour.
> >> Not for procreation of course, but they do indulge.
> >
> > Pleasure wasn't the issue..
> > Furthering the species is.
> >
> > I can care less what people do for fun but don't try to convince me
> it's
> > "normal"
> >
>
> Go back to what I said. I said many species indulge in homosexual
> behaviour. Now, humans are just one of those species.
>
> Besides, what is considered "normal" depends on your viewpoint and
> experiences. Since homosexuality is really a rather small sector of the
> human species and is ingrained in most of those individuals, I have no
> problem with it. I also have no interest in it other than fairness.

In that we can aggree..

==============================================================================
TOPIC: A test for young people
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/e250300c60eaaa8e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 6:55 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

Stormin Mormon wrote:
>
> And, what business is it, of government, to set prices for
> the market? Yes, they do it all the time. But, I don't
> belive I've seen it in the Constitution where they are given
> the authority.

What business is it of yours that they want to prevent big companies
from putting everyone else out of business, then gouging the customers
when there is no other choice?

--
Greed is the root of all eBay.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT - Most states remain blue ...and sane.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d00573543954f95d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:09 pm
From: "HH&C"

On Feb 2, 11:46 am, "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
> On Feb 1, 10:10 pm, Too_Many_Tools <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > The other nine most Democratic states are Rhode Island,
> > Massachusetts,
> > Maryland, Vermont, Hawaii, New York, Illinois, Connecticut and
> > Delaware. Each of the top 10 Democratic states had more than a 22
> > percentage point party affiliation advantage for the Democrats.
>
> Massachusetts? Sure didn't get Martha Coakley elected there in a
> recent statewide election against Scott Brown, did it?
> Wake up. The masses are rejecting liberalism and liberals - if they
> haven't already. Even in Massachusetts.

Yep. The masses are rejecting liberal Republicans, too.

> Election Day - now 10 months and a couple days away. Bet LOTS of
> liberals get Coakleyed.
>
> http://www.Internet-Gun-Show.com- your source for hard-to-find stuff!

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:10 pm
From: "HH&C"

On Feb 3, 12:29 am, "RogerN" <re...@midwest.net> wrote:
> \"Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:32a84355-446d-40b6-983c-\21cdf29b1__BEGIN_MASK_n#9g02mG7!__...__END_MASK_i?a63jfAD$z__@k22g2000vbp.googlegroups.com...
> \Hmm...looks like Americans can see through the craziness of the
> \Republicans.
> \
> \TMT
>
> Well, according to you and the Democrats, spending money to fight terrorists
> is insane, spending money to defend them is OK though. Oh, you forgot to
> post about Obama's all time record deficit. Make sure you get all Biblical
> references out of the military and get homosexuals in.
>
> RogerN

It's not a good time to be a politician of any stripe. Solid
conservatives are the only ones likely to make it through this.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:20 pm
From: "Ed Huntress"

"HH&C" <hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a32bf0a3-7e3e-46ee-b548-42574f2ba857@d27g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 2, 11:46 am, "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
> On Feb 1, 10:10 pm, Too_Many_Tools <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > The other nine most Democratic states are Rhode Island,
> > Massachusetts,
> > Maryland, Vermont, Hawaii, New York, Illinois, Connecticut and
> > Delaware. Each of the top 10 Democratic states had more than a 22
> > percentage point party affiliation advantage for the Democrats.
>
> Massachusetts? Sure didn't get Martha Coakley elected there in a
> recent statewide election against Scott Brown, did it?
> Wake up. The masses are rejecting liberalism and liberals - if they
> haven't already. Even in Massachusetts.

>Yep. The masses are rejecting liberal Republicans, too.

Scott Brown supports a woman's right to abortion; he opposes having the
federal government ban gay marriage; and, having lived on welfare as a
child, he's "moderate" on that issue. He supports the Massachusetts
universal health care insurance plan that forces residents to buy insurance.

Sure, Massachusetts rejected a liberal Republican. Right. The Republicans
might find they should have supported Coakley. <g>

--
Ed Huntress

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT - Why the GOP should still be nervous...very, very nervous.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/37096cdc6028afa4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:13 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

"RD (The Sandman)" wrote:
>
> John Husvar <jhusvar@sbcglobal.net> wrote in news:jhusvar-
> 23135C.08381705022010@news.eternal-september.org:
>
> > In article <4B6C187C.9AEFBE2E@earthlink.net>,
> > "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Winston_Smith wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Why does a light switch say on and off? If it's on you don't need
> to
> >> > read about it. If it's off you can't read it.
> >>
> >>
> >> You've never seen a light switch in daylight?
> >
> > Then there's the possibility the light the switch controls isn't
> visible
> > from the switch's location.
>
> His comment was a bit of humor not to be taken seriously.

Femto humor?

--
Greed is the root of all eBay.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:13 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

John Husvar wrote:
>
> In article <4B6C187C.9AEFBE2E@earthlink.net>,
> "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > Winston_Smith wrote:
> > >
> > > Why does a light switch say on and off? If it's on you don't need to
> > > read about it. If it's off you can't read it.
> >
> >
> > You've never seen a light switch in daylight?
>
> Then there's the possibility the light the switch controls isn't visible
> from the switch's location.

Agreed. I didn't want him to have to think too much, all at once. :)

--
Greed is the root of all eBay.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: South Bend New Products in Grizzly Catalog Includes a SB 4x6 Bandsaw
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/c396e7ad33ab5f5e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:15 pm
From: Jim Wilkins

On Feb 5, 8:53 pm, "Michael Koblic" <mkob...@gmail.com> wrote:
> ...
> I have been monitoring their web site. They led me to believe that they will
> be restarting production in US with a number of new items. However, their
> small lathes have been perpetually marked as "coming soon".
> Disappointing...
> Michael Koblic,

The lathes they were famous for were throwbacks to the 1920's. Mine
would easily adapt to an overhead lineshaft drive.

jsw

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hey Ed, that snow coming up your way?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/5da3fd42a63375e4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:19 pm
From: Too_Many_Tools

On Feb 5, 7:22 pm, "Ed Huntress" <huntre...@optonline.net> wrote:
> "Wes" <clu...@lycos.com> wrote in message
>
> news:hkic3l$tn1$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> >I was a bit touched you worried about me when the storm was on up my way a
> >month or two
> > back. Now I'm concerned about you and yours. What does it look like at
> > your end? Sounds
> > like you are going to get dumped on in a place that really doesn't
> > understand how to deal
> > with snow.
>
> > Hope your pantry is stocked up.
>
> > Wes
>
> It hasn't started yet -- any minute now. But the latest report shows it
> passing mostly to the south of us. Atlantic City may wind up with two feet.
> We probably won't get more than 6 inches.
>
> My son, however, just got clobbered. (He's in Lexington, VA, in the
> Shenandoah Valley.) They really aren't used to that much snow. They have a
> foot and they're getting up to another foot.
>
> Anyway, I just cut up two chickens (and cooked some skinless breasts in
> cream and mushroom sauce); I have a three-pound piece of fresh salmon in the
> 'fridge; ten round steaks, a chuck roast, and four center-cut pork chops in
> the freezer; five pounds of potatoes and lots of other vegetables and other
> stuff.
>
> Let it snow. <g> I'm baking a pumpkin pie and I'll make some cornbread in a
> few minutes. And thanks for asking, Wes. We actually have good, and quick
> snow removal here. And my neighbor has a truck with a big plow on it. I've
> got it made.
>
> --
> Ed Huntress

Sounds like a prepared survivalist to me. ;<)

TMT

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:34 pm
From: "DoN. Nichols"

On 2010-02-06, Ed Huntress <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> "Wes" <clutch@lycos.com> wrote in message
> news:hkic3l$tn1$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>I was a bit touched you worried about me when the storm was on up my way a
>>month or two
>> back. Now I'm concerned about you and yours. What does it look like at
>> your end? Sounds
>> like you are going to get dumped on in a place that really doesn't
>> understand how to deal
>> with snow.
>>
>> Hope your pantry is stocked up.
>>
>> Wes
>
> It hasn't started yet -- any minute now. But the latest report shows it
> passing mostly to the south of us. Atlantic City may wind up with two feet.
> We probably won't get more than 6 inches.

Hmm ... we've already got 8" based on the pile on the deck
railing, maybe deeper if I went out to actually measure it.

> My son, however, just got clobbered. (He's in Lexington, VA, in the
> Shenandoah Valley.) They really aren't used to that much snow. They have a
> foot and they're getting up to another foot.

Vienna VA, and we're predicted to get a total between 20 to 30"

[ ... ]

> Let it snow. <g> I'm baking a pumpkin pie and I'll make some cornbread in a
> few minutes. And thanks for asking, Wes. We actually have good, and quick
> snow removal here. And my neighbor has a truck with a big plow on it. I've
> got it made.

Our rent-a-daughter has to go to work early tomorrow. She's
"essential personell", so she may have to take our Mazda Navajo for the
4WD and high ground clearance -- assuming that our street even gets
plowed by then.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: <dnichols@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Failin' Palin fails to pay taxes on two houses she owns..........LOL!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/af53d8ce4d7352ca?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:26 pm
From: Curly Surmudgeon

On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 16:56:40 -0800, Too_Many_Tools
<too_many_tools@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Feb 5, 6:12 pm, "Buerste" <buer...@wowway.com> wrote:
>> "Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:9d741a0b-
bcde-448a-94d0-47c84623b1ea@d37g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
>> On Feb 5, 1:58 am, "Buerste" <buer...@wowway.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > "Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>
>> >news:89960a3a-
b9f4-4abd-8359-6f1f033ca35b@g1g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...
>> > On Feb 4, 11:44 pm, "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
>>
>> > > It's not the property owner's fault if the assessor screws up - and
>> > > that's all that happened in the Palin case.
>>
>> > >http://www.Internet-Gun-Show.com-yoursource for hard-to-find stuff!
>>
>> > LOL...poor deluded idiot.
>>
>> > Why was the "error" in her favor?
>>
>> > And now that the taxcheater is out of the bag...will Palin be willing
>> > to pay ALL the back taxes?
>>
>> > Stay tuned.
>>
>> > TMT
>> > ***************************************************
>>
>> > Geithner-$25,970.00, Daschle-$100,000.00, Rangel-$75,000.00? and all
>> > the other libtards are REAL tax cheats, Palin owes $1.49 for hunting
>> > cabin structures made from sticks and mud.
>> > Tax cheats are OVERWHELMINGLY Demoturds! I'm surprised you'd bring
>> > this up as it is such an obvious Demoturd activity.
>>
>> LOL...another conservative that needs a visit from the IRS auditor.
>>
>> Did you know that anyone who turns you in gets a cut of the money
>> recovered?
>>
>> And of course you have told us how great business is so we are talking
>> real money here.
>>
>> Laugh..laugh..laugh..
>>
>> TMT
>> *******************************************************
>>
>> Any time you like, I will send you my accounting firm's name and number
>> along with out IRS contact. However, if no discrepancy is found, you
>> will forfeit the $10,000 that you will put in an escrow account before
>> you start this folly and you will pay any fees needed by my accounting
>> firm. Agreed?
>>
>> See, that's the difference between people like me that don't ever cheat
>> and libtards that ALWAYS cheat. Google "morals" some day and read up
>> on the subject.
>>
>> No, I STILL won't hire you, you could never be trusted, you have no
>> skills and my people would refuse to work with a non-productive
>> employee. Even the union wouldn't allow you a job here.- Hide quoted
>> text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> I will save you the cost of the stamp.
>
> Post the information here so we can all make share in the spoils.
>
> So go ahead...put up or shut up winger.
>
> We're ALL waiting....
>
> TMT

Before Bozo Filtering Buerste I, too, challenged him to put some serious
cash where his mouth is.

He refused.

--
Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Bible: Slavery good. Gays bad. Snakes talk.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Feb 5 2010 7:33 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

Buerste wrote:
>
> "Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_tools@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:9d741a0b-bcde-448a-94d0-47c84623b1ea@d37g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 5, 1:58 am, "Buerste" <buer...@wowway.com> wrote:
> > "Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >
> > news:89960a3a-b9f4-4abd-8359-6f1f033ca35b@g1g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...
> > On Feb 4, 11:44 pm, "edi...@netpath.net" <edi...@netpath.net> wrote:
> >
> > > It's not the property owner's fault if the assessor screws up - and
> > > that's all that happened in the Palin case.
> >
> > >http://www.Internet-Gun-Show.com-your source for hard-to-find stuff!
> >
> > LOL...poor deluded idiot.
> >
> > Why was the "error" in her favor?
> >
> > And now that the taxcheater is out of the bag...will Palin be willing
> > to pay ALL the back taxes?
> >
> > Stay tuned.
> >
> > TMT
> > ***************************************************
> >
> > Geithner-$25,970.00, Daschle-$100,000.00, Rangel-$75,000.00? and all the
> > other libtards are REAL tax cheats, Palin owes $1.49 for hunting cabin
> > structures made from sticks and mud.
> > Tax cheats are OVERWHELMINGLY Demoturds! I'm surprised you'd bring this up
> > as it is such an obvious Demoturd activity.
>
> LOL...another conservative that needs a visit from the IRS auditor.
>
> Did you know that anyone who turns you in gets a cut of the money
> recovered?
>
> And of course you have told us how great business is so we are talking
> real money here.
>
> Laugh..laugh..laugh..
>
> TMT
> *******************************************************
>
> Any time you like, I will send you my accounting firm's name and number
> along with out IRS contact. However, if no discrepancy is found, you will
> forfeit the $10,000 that you will put in an escrow account before you start
> this folly and you will pay any fees needed by my accounting firm. Agreed?

Where would he get $10,000?

> See, that's the difference between people like me that don't ever cheat and
> libtards that ALWAYS cheat. Google "morals" some day and read up on the
> subject.
>
> No, I STILL won't hire you, you could never be trusted, you have no skills
> and my people would refuse to work with a non-productive employee. Even the
> union wouldn't allow you a job here.

--
Greed is the root of all eBay.

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Friday, February 5, 2010

rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 10 topics - digest

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