rec.crafts.metalworking - 26 new messages in 8 topics - digest
rec.crafts.metalworking
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking?hl=en
rec.crafts.metalworking@googlegroups.com
Today's topics:
* LISTED!!!! Re: Capitalism - 12 messages, 6 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d25f33eee8f60f6f?hl=en
* Obama Told Aides He's 'Really Good At Killing People' - 7 messages, 4
authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d01f4b49a8911d6f?hl=en
* Food stamps cut by 5 billion dollars... - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8ece202a1d5b98bf?hl=en
* This may be of some iinterest.... - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/18a5e6c1f118f8b3?hl=en
* $$$ MAKE CASH NOW $$$ - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/4e582aeb8ba021b3?hl=en
* An open letter to President Obama - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/6a0df9f0b0758d3e?hl=en
* Science Quiz - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/e86758e53ea3692c?hl=en
* Navy SEALs ordered to remove 'don't tread on me' Navy Jack from uniforms - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/4ed0d43cae18ef8a?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: LISTED!!!! Re: Capitalism
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d25f33eee8f60f6f?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 6:11 am
From: Guy Fawkes
Hunter of the Shadows <nochsfentor@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:7MGdnXVd6OVY1erPnZ2dnUVZ5vKdnZ2d@giganews.com:
> On 11/3/2013 9:50 PM, Guy Fawkes wrote:
>> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote in news:chine.bleu-
>> E2A3B8.20410003112013@news.eternal-september.org:
>>
>>> In article <XnsA26DE22C2C82CWereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
>>> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) wrote in
news:1lbs5v9.1wfmtno15uh446N%
>>>> snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk:
>>>>
>>>>> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote in
>>>>>> news:chine.bleu-58E5F4.13020103112013@news.eternal-september.org:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In article <XnsA26DA1257773BWereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
>>>>>>> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Do you REALLY think he would have won 2 elections?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you have to lie to me to get me to do something that ultimately
>>>>>>>> hurts me, then you are my enemy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We can balance the budget by cutting taxes and increasing military
>>>>>>> spending.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My goodness. You are a stupid, stupid person.
>>>>>
>>>>> A devastating riposte if ever I saw one, I'm very impressed.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Who gives a fuck what the you "think".
>>>
>>> So how long has Ronald Reagan been your enemy?
>>
>> You are a profundly stupid individual.
>>
>
> You are really stupid as hell.
Please to commit hari kari out of the great shame you have brought on your
family for posting here and displaying your genetic inferiority.
--
There is no court for his crimes.
"V"
== 2 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 6:12 am
From: Guy Fawkes
Hunter of the Shadows <nochsfentor@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:7MGdnXpd6OXV1erPnZ2dnUVZ5vKdnZ2d@giganews.com:
> On 11/3/2013 1:50 PM, Guy Fawkes wrote:
>
>> If you have to lie to me to get me to do something that ultimately
>> hurts me, then you are my enemy.
>
> Only if you figure out that I did that. If you never realize I was
> lying or that it hurt you, I am your best friend with my knife in your
> back.
You really don't grasp the immorality that you have just embraced?
You are not simply my enemy, you are the enemy of civilization.
OTOH, it's nice to see a lib admitting the truth, however rare that is.
--
There is no court for his crimes.
"V"
== 3 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 5:25 am
From: Siri Cruz
In article <XnsA26E5DB2D69A5Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> Hunter of the Shadows <nochsfentor@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:7MGdnXpd6OXV1erPnZ2dnUVZ5vKdnZ2d@giganews.com:
>
> > On 11/3/2013 1:50 PM, Guy Fawkes wrote:
> >
> >> If you have to lie to me to get me to do something that ultimately
> >> hurts me, then you are my enemy.
> >
> > Only if you figure out that I did that. If you never realize I was
> > lying or that it hurt you, I am your best friend with my knife in your
> > back.
>
> You really don't grasp the immorality that you have just embraced?
>
> You are not simply my enemy, you are the enemy of civilization.
>
> OTOH, it's nice to see a lib admitting the truth, however rare that is.
Chill out.
~~ Civilisation
--
Guajira Guantanamera: Hell hath no fury like a nation scorned.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
CIA Constitution patriot terrorism freedom Snowden
Paid Maternity Leave NSA fodder Dirty Dozen 2 Bomb
== 4 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 6:25 am
From: snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe)
Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> >> You are a profundly stupid individual.
> >
> > You are really stupid as hell.
>
> Please to commit hari kari out of the great shame you have brought on your
> family for posting here and displaying your genetic inferiority.
YSTHM "harakiri" or "seppuku" HTH HAND HORSE
--
^Ï^. Sn!pe <snipe@notforspam.fsnet.co.uk>
My pet rock Gordon just is.
== 5 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 5:25 am
From: Siri Cruz
In article <XnsA26E5D75EBBFAWereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> Hunter of the Shadows <nochsfentor@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:7MGdnXVd6OVY1erPnZ2dnUVZ5vKdnZ2d@giganews.com:
>
> > On 11/3/2013 9:50 PM, Guy Fawkes wrote:
> >> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote in news:chine.bleu-
> >> E2A3B8.20410003112013@news.eternal-september.org:
> >>
> >>> In article <XnsA26DE22C2C82CWereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
> >>> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) wrote in
> news:1lbs5v9.1wfmtno15uh446N%
> >>>> snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote in
> >>>>>> news:chine.bleu-58E5F4.13020103112013@news.eternal-september.org:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> In article <XnsA26DA1257773BWereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
> >>>>>>> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Do you REALLY think he would have won 2 elections?
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> If you have to lie to me to get me to do something that ultimately
> >>>>>>>> hurts me, then you are my enemy.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> We can balance the budget by cutting taxes and increasing military
> >>>>>>> spending.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> My goodness. You are a stupid, stupid person.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> A devastating riposte if ever I saw one, I'm very impressed.
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Who gives a fuck what the you "think".
> >>>
> >>> So how long has Ronald Reagan been your enemy?
> >>
> >> You are a profundly stupid individual.
> >>
> >
> > You are really stupid as hell.
>
> Please to commit hari kari out of the great shame you have brought on your
> family for posting here and displaying your genetic inferiority.
How long have you been interested in racial hygiene?
--
Guajira Guantanamera: Hell hath no fury like a nation scorned.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
CIA Constitution patriot terrorism freedom Snowden
Paid Maternity Leave NSA fodder Dirty Dozen 2 Bomb
== 6 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 5:26 am
From: Siri Cruz
In article <XnsA26E5D2EED452Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> Hunter of the Shadows <nochsfentor@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:7MGdnXRd6OWD1OrPnZ2dnUVZ5vKdnZ2d@giganews.com:
>
> > On 11/3/2013 8:15 PM, Guy Fawkes wrote:
> >> Gary Burnore <gburnore@panix.com> wrote in
> >> news:l56im5$s62$5@reader1.panix.com:
> >>
> >>> In alt.usenet.kooks Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote:
> >>>> On Sun, 3 Nov 2013 20:50:09 +0000 (UTC), in the land of
> >>>> alt.usenet.kooks, Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> Pleasantly
> >>>> Postulated::
> >>>>
> >>>>> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote in
> >>>>> news:chine.bleu-54D680.10204103112013@news.eternal-september.org:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> In article <XnsA26D78A3A93F9Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
> >>>>>> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote in news:chine.bleu-
> >>>>>>> 149091.18300502112013@news.eternal-september.org:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> In article
> >>>>>>>> <MPG.2cdeebb9ea55f19698a11b@news.eternal-september.org>,
> >>>>>>>> Johnny Johnson <TopCop1988@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> It's just one of *many* phony nyms this VLILLLDM has used:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Siri Cruise
> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Clay
> >>>>>>>>> Big Trouble in Little China Blue
> >>>>>>>>> Acid Washed China Blue Jeans
> >>>>>>>>> Very Dark Blue, China Blue Condition
> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Corn Chips
> >>>>>>>>> [the China Blue] Drill Baby Drill
> >>>>>>>>> Don't make my brown eyes China Blue
> >>>>>>>>> In a Very Dark Blue, China Blue Condition
> >>>>>>>>> Light the China Blue Touch Paper
> >>>>>>>>> Chicken Cordon Bleu
> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Veins
> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Jay Way
> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Ribbon
> >>>>>>>>> Where did you get those China Blue jeans
> >>>>>>>>> Out of the China Blue
> >>>>>>>>> Wall of China Blue
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> among others.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> A lsit of my very own. The rest of you should be jealous.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> So basically you are a sockpuppet. Your philosphy is so corrupt, so
> >>>>>>> gutter, so debased it can only be sold by the lies of liars.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Yeah. So?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So? Do you not grasp that a philosophy based on lies might just to a
> >>>>> small extent be BAD?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Or are so immersed in the lies that the lies have become truth? Of
> >>>>> course objective truth does you no good, correct?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> What of Obama had said, you won't be able to keep your insurance. You
> >>>>> won't be able to keep your doctor. Your premiums and your dedeductibles
> >>>>> will go up markedly.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Do you REALLY think he would have won 2 elections?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> If you have to lie to me to get me to do something that ultimately
> >>>>> hurts me, then you are my enemy.
> >>>>
> >>>> For 3% of the populqation you stupid fuck.
> >>>> 75-80% are employer insured you mindless drone.
> >>>> That leaves 20-25% of the population you dumb motherfucker.
> >>>> 16-18% are not even fucking insured you ignorant fuckstubble.
> >>>> That leaves around 6% of the population in the individual market you
> >>>> brainless dipwad.
> >>>> Of that 6% are in the individual market you doltish toad licker.
> >>>> Only 1/2 of those will see an increase in their Insurance costs you
> >>>> insensate stonehead.
> >>>>
> >>>> So 3% of the population MAY see an increase in their Insurance rates.
> >>>> Many of them live in states where the Governor and/or Legislature
> >>>> refused to exand Medicaid and/or set up state run excanges and as a
> >>>> consequence fucked their own constituents.
> >>>>
> >>>> So, fuckweasels like you fed a pablum of lies and misrepresentations
> >>>> wail like newborns that 3% of the population may have to pay an
> >>>> average of $90.00 a month more for insurance while 16% of the
> >>>> population that NEVER FUCKING had insurance are getting insured.
> >>>>
> >>>> Jesus fuck Siri overestimated your intelligence by at least 10X.
> >>>>
> >>> OMFG I can't stop laughing. Fuckstubble? That's hillarious.
> >>>
> >>> That your post is 100% spot on has GOT to piss him off.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> Insignificant people don't matter. You are one of them.
> >>
> >
> > I can tell that you are an extremely stupid person.
>
> You can't tell time. Yours is past.
Ooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhh nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnooooooooooo!
The Great Cull is coming!
--
Guajira Guantanamera: Hell hath no fury like a nation scorned.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
CIA Constitution patriot terrorism freedom Snowden
Paid Maternity Leave NSA fodder Dirty Dozen 2 Bomb
== 7 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 6:35 am
From: snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe)
Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote:
> In article <XnsA26E5DB2D69A5Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
[...]
> > OTOH, it's nice to see a lib admitting the truth, however rare that is.
>
> Chill out.
> ~~ Civilisation
Remember, remember, the Fifth of September,
Gunpowder, Treason and Plot.
Marshmallows on sticks while the chestnuts are roasting,
Catholics sizzle on top.
--
^Ï^. Sn!pe <snipe@notforspam.fsnet.co.uk>
My pet rock Gordon just is.
== 8 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 6:48 am
From: Checkmate
Warning! Always wear ANSI approved safety goggles when reading posts by
Checkmate!
On Mon, 4 Nov 2013 14:10:07 +0000 (UTC), Guy Fawkes put forth the notion
that:
>
> snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) wrote in news:1lbstdx.19r3ew31will59N%
> snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk:
>
> > Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > [...]
> >
> >> >> >> My goodness. You are a stupid, stupid person.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > A devastating riposte if ever I saw one, I'm very impressed.
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> Who gives a fuck what the you "think".
> >> >
> >> > So how long has Ronald Reagan been your enemy?
> >>
> >> You are a profundly stupid individual.
> >
> > Another utterly convincing argument,
> > I'm completely awed by your debating skills.
> >
>
> Fortunately I am not fooled by your lies.
You're just saying that.
--
Checkmate
KotAGoR XXXIV
AUK Hammer of Thor award, Feb. 2012
co-winner, Pierre Salinger Memorial Hook,
Line & Sinker award, May 2001
Copyright © 2013
all rights reserved
My poor people skills??? You sir, are fucked in the head."
-Emmett Gulley
== 9 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 6:21 am
From: Siri Cruz
In article <1lbtesy.13y1dznn14ip1N%snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk>,
snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) wrote:
> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <XnsA26E5DB2D69A5Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
> > Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> > > OTOH, it's nice to see a lib admitting the truth, however rare that is.
> >
> > Chill out.
> > ~~ Civilisation
>
> Remember, remember, the Fifth of September,
> Gunpowder, Treason and Plot.
> Marshmallows on sticks while the chestnuts are roasting,
> Catholics sizzle on top.
For some reasons some American think Fawkes is a hero. Apparently blowing up a
legislature makes you daring rebel even if your purpose is to introduce a
Parliament free Catholic king.
--
Guajira Guantanamera: Hell hath no fury like a nation scorned.
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
CIA Constitution patriot terrorism freedom Snowden
Paid Maternity Leave NSA fodder Dirty Dozen 2 Bomb
== 10 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 7:34 am
From: Johnny Johnson
In article <6kse795ce0tj1rf8fbvoif35bq1mo9g697@4ax.com>, AStaton@elgereth.com
says...
>
> On Sun, 3 Nov 2013 20:37:17 +0000 (UTC), Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>> AStaton@elgereth.com wrote in
>> news:c13d791aflseofhkoi98s14qqlm0j14ui1@4ax.com:
>>
>>> On Sun, 3 Nov 2013 17:38:56 +0000 (UTC), Guy Fawkes
>>> <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> AStaton@elgereth.com wrote in
>>>> news:742d7996uu22ujh7o3aieb36dfme3forsd@4ax.com:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 3 Nov 2013 17:27:21 +0000 (UTC), Guy Fawkes
>>>>> <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>AStaton@elgereth.com wrote in
>>>>>>news:ht0d795be3ur6gqfpdcavsrnclqdftitk6@4ax.com:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Nov 2013 14:42:31 +0000 (UTC), Guy Fawkes
>>>>>>> <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Matt Warner <Matt@gmail.com-spam> wrote in
>>>>>>>>news:l52cuj014ah@news6.newsguy.com:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Nov 2013 04:26:05 +0000 (UTC), Guy Fawkes
>>>>>>>>><No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> BTW, where the fuck do you think gummint gets it's money from
>>>>>>>>>> anyway?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> All gummints print money.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Oh I see, a moron. Money is paper. Money in and of itself is
>>>>>>>>meaningless. It is a convenient measure of wealth.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That wasn't always so, Guy. There was a time when monetary notes
>>>>>>> stated 'Will Pay To Bearer On Demand.' There was gold to back up the
>>>>>>> money. You can thank the Nixon admin for eliminating the gold
>>>>>>> standard. During Gerald Ford's term, the gold mysteriously
>>>>>>> disappeared from Ft. Knox:
>>>>>>> http://www.silverdoctors.com/1981-article-7000-tons-of-gold-bullion-r
>>>>>>> em ov ed-from-fort-knox-from-1973-74/ Since it was no longer being
>>>>>>> used to back the money, it was removed (read pocketed). One could
>>>>>>> probably make a very educated guess as to who(plural) got rich off
>>>>>>> this.Since 1971, our money has not been backed by anything of value.
>>>>>>> It is simply script.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>And obviously all Republican's fault.
>>>>>
>>>>> I stand corrected. Nixon was still president during the gold heist.
>>>>> Ford became VP in '73 because dear old Spiro got caught evading taxes
>>>>> and money laundering. The gold was removed during 73-74. Ford was
>>>>> president from 74-77. But your point stands.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Um, you still have not proved that the gold was removed from Fort Knox.
>>>>
>>>>Your simply saying so does not constitute proof. Not saying that I don't
>>>>think it's possible, I am just one of those people who likes to see
>>>>evidence.
>>>
>>> Sorry, I thought you had read the cite I included. Here it is again:
>>> http://www.silverdoctors.com/1981-article-7000-tons-of-gold-bullion-remov
>>> ed-from-fort-knox-from-1973-74/
>>>
>>> Here is another:
>>> http://www.lewrockwell.com/2010/08/chris-weber/the-great-american-disaste
>>> r-how-much-gold-remains-in-fortknox/
>>>
>>> As for proof that Ft. Knox is empty, that is laughable. No one is
>>> allowed to visit, no exceptions. Pretty much like all government lies,
>>> they can tell us what they want, make it top secret to find out the
>>> truth and bury it forever to keep it from surfacing. As to whether R's
>>> or D's were responsible, I'd probably hedge my bet and say both. Suffice
>>> it to say, that we eliminated the gold standard entirely in 1971. The
>>> question is....why?
>>
>> Still it is only surmise until you get in there and conduct an inventory.
>
> True sir. But it begs the question: Why did we go off of the gold standard at
> the same time as this article was written?
>
Simple enough: we didn't.
As I proved, and apparently you igored, Franklin Delano Roosevelt took us off
the gold standard back in 1933.
>
>>2 words come to mind. Paranoia and conspiracy. Lacking concrete PROOF that
>>is all you have.
>
> Perhaps it is just paranoia and conspiracy. But I have seen all too much reality
> from our government to not be at least a bit skeptical. I wouldn't put it past
> any politician, Left or Right, to try and go after the brass ring if they
> thought they could get away with it.
>
> I'll put the question to you: Why did we go off of the gold standard. I mean
> they had stopped paying American citizens in gold for the money years earlier.
>
That, by definition, was the end of "the gold standard" of backing currency
and "coins of the realm."
>
> In 1971 they stopped offering it for the money to the rest of the world.
> The question is, why?
>
Asked and answered -- and answer ignored.
>
> Any thoughts, or just Ad Hominem that I am paranoid and a conspiracist?
>
Well, AStaton: "If the Foo shits...."
>
> A real dialogua would be appreciated.
> After all, you were the one who wrote that money in of itself is meaningless.
> That wasn't always true, but since 1971 it certainly is.
>
From the FAQs of the Federal Reserve Bank of Richmond (VA):
When did the United States go off the gold standard?
H.J. Res. 192, approved by President Roosevelt on June 5, 1933, provided that
obligations payable in gold or specific coin or currency are contrary to
public policy, and that those obligations could be discharged dollar for
dollar in legal tender. After that resolution was adopted, currency of the
United States could not be converted into gold by United States citizens, but
the Treasury would convert dollars into gold for foreign governments as a
means of maintaining stability and confidence in the dollar. Because the
dollar was no longer freely convertible, one could consider that the United
States was no longer on the gold standard at that time.
So, AStaton: unless you were a foreign country, you've been "off the gold
standard" since *long* before you were born.
== 11 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 8:35 am
From: Johnny Johnson
In article <1lbrtsu.19uey3bdxpioeN%snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk>, Sn!pe
<snipe@fsnet.co.uk> says...
>
> Checkmate <LunaticFringe@The.Edge> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In article <MPG.2cdeebb9ea55f19698a11b@news.eternal-september.org>,
>>> Johnny Johnson <TopCop1988@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> It's just one of *many* phony nyms this VLILLLDM has used:
>>>>
>>>> Siri Cruise
>>>> China Blue Clay
>>>> Big Trouble in Little China Blue
>>>> Acid Washed China Blue Jeans
>>>> Very Dark Blue, China Blue Condition
>>>> China Blue Corn Chips
>>>> [the China Blue] Drill Baby Drill
>>>> Don't make my brown eyes China Blue
>>>> In a Very Dark Blue, China Blue Condition
>>>> Light the China Blue Touch Paper
>>>> Chicken Cordon Bleu
>>>> China Blue Veins
>>>> China Blue Jay Way
>>>> China Blue Ribbon
>>>> Where did you get those China Blue jeans
>>>> Out of the China Blue
>>>> Wall of China Blue
>>>>
>>>> among others.
>>>
>>> A lsit {SIC} of my very own.
>>> The rest of you should be jealous.
>>>
>>>> YSTHM 'envious' and yes I am.
>>>> BTW, what does 'VLILLLDM' mean?
>>>
>>> I have no idea. And I'm okay with that.
>
And it fits *you* to a "T", Bleu Balls.
Thanks for admitting it. :)
>
>> I was okay with that when I read it too...
>> just in case you were wondering.
>
> But, but, it's piqued my 'satiable curtiousity.
>
The answer has been posted many times over -- feel free to locate it for
yourselves. ;)
I will say this, though: all but the "D" applies equally to both U.S. and
"Yoo Kay" Liberals.
== 12 of 12 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 10:13 am
From: Gunner Asch
On Mon, 04 Nov 2013 06:26:56 -0700, Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com>
wrote:
>In article <XnsA26E5D2EED452Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Hunter of the Shadows <nochsfentor@yahoo.com> wrote in
>> news:7MGdnXRd6OWD1OrPnZ2dnUVZ5vKdnZ2d@giganews.com:
>>
>> > On 11/3/2013 8:15 PM, Guy Fawkes wrote:
>> >> Gary Burnore <gburnore@panix.com> wrote in
>> >> news:l56im5$s62$5@reader1.panix.com:
>> >>
>> >>> In alt.usenet.kooks Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote:
>> >>>> On Sun, 3 Nov 2013 20:50:09 +0000 (UTC), in the land of
>> >>>> alt.usenet.kooks, Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> Pleasantly
>> >>>> Postulated::
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote in
>> >>>>> news:chine.bleu-54D680.10204103112013@news.eternal-september.org:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> In article <XnsA26D78A3A93F9Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116>,
>> >>>>>> Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote in news:chine.bleu-
>> >>>>>>> 149091.18300502112013@news.eternal-september.org:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> In article
>> >>>>>>>> <MPG.2cdeebb9ea55f19698a11b@news.eternal-september.org>,
>> >>>>>>>> Johnny Johnson <TopCop1988@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> It's just one of *many* phony nyms this VLILLLDM has used:
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> Siri Cruise
>> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Clay
>> >>>>>>>>> Big Trouble in Little China Blue
>> >>>>>>>>> Acid Washed China Blue Jeans
>> >>>>>>>>> Very Dark Blue, China Blue Condition
>> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Corn Chips
>> >>>>>>>>> [the China Blue] Drill Baby Drill
>> >>>>>>>>> Don't make my brown eyes China Blue
>> >>>>>>>>> In a Very Dark Blue, China Blue Condition
>> >>>>>>>>> Light the China Blue Touch Paper
>> >>>>>>>>> Chicken Cordon Bleu
>> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Veins
>> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Jay Way
>> >>>>>>>>> China Blue Ribbon
>> >>>>>>>>> Where did you get those China Blue jeans
>> >>>>>>>>> Out of the China Blue
>> >>>>>>>>> Wall of China Blue
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> among others.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> A lsit of my very own. The rest of you should be jealous.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> So basically you are a sockpuppet. Your philosphy is so corrupt, so
>> >>>>>>> gutter, so debased it can only be sold by the lies of liars.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Yeah. So?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> So? Do you not grasp that a philosophy based on lies might just to a
>> >>>>> small extent be BAD?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Or are so immersed in the lies that the lies have become truth? Of
>> >>>>> course objective truth does you no good, correct?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> What of Obama had said, you won't be able to keep your insurance. You
>> >>>>> won't be able to keep your doctor. Your premiums and your dedeductibles
>> >>>>> will go up markedly.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Do you REALLY think he would have won 2 elections?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> If you have to lie to me to get me to do something that ultimately
>> >>>>> hurts me, then you are my enemy.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> For 3% of the populqation you stupid fuck.
>> >>>> 75-80% are employer insured you mindless drone.
>> >>>> That leaves 20-25% of the population you dumb motherfucker.
>> >>>> 16-18% are not even fucking insured you ignorant fuckstubble.
>> >>>> That leaves around 6% of the population in the individual market you
>> >>>> brainless dipwad.
>> >>>> Of that 6% are in the individual market you doltish toad licker.
>> >>>> Only 1/2 of those will see an increase in their Insurance costs you
>> >>>> insensate stonehead.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> So 3% of the population MAY see an increase in their Insurance rates.
>> >>>> Many of them live in states where the Governor and/or Legislature
>> >>>> refused to exand Medicaid and/or set up state run excanges and as a
>> >>>> consequence fucked their own constituents.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> So, fuckweasels like you fed a pablum of lies and misrepresentations
>> >>>> wail like newborns that 3% of the population may have to pay an
>> >>>> average of $90.00 a month more for insurance while 16% of the
>> >>>> population that NEVER FUCKING had insurance are getting insured.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Jesus fuck Siri overestimated your intelligence by at least 10X.
>> >>>>
>> >>> OMFG I can't stop laughing. Fuckstubble? That's hillarious.
>> >>>
>> >>> That your post is 100% spot on has GOT to piss him off.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> Insignificant people don't matter. You are one of them.
>> >>
>> >
>> > I can tell that you are an extremely stupid person.
>>
>> You can't tell time. Yours is past.
>
>Ooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhh nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnooooooooooo!
>The Great Cull is coming!
If I were you.....Id not be buying anything except for cash....else
your creditors may be very disappointed.
--
"Their mommies tell them they're special, Liberals just don't understand
that "special" is a polite euphemism for;
*window licker on the short bus*"
---
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Obama Told Aides He's 'Really Good At Killing People'
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d01f4b49a8911d6f?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 7 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 6:15 am
From: Guy Fawkes
rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote in news:bdojtrFhsm1U1
@mid.individual.net:
> Guy Fawkes wrote:
>
>> Well the real pioneer was RAF Bomber Command. Unfortunately I am of the
>> opinion that Harris was quite wrong in his approach. A more targeted
>> campaign, better coordianted with the USAAF would have been more
>> effective.
>>
>
> Bomber Harris was just your common garden variety Brit war criminal. If
> there is a hell, maybe he'll get a taste of what he wrought.
>
>
I cannot disagree. He was insubordinate to the Commander of the Air Force
and even to Churchill. He should have been sacked.
--
There is no court for his crimes.
"V"
== 2 of 7 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 7:06 am
From: "Jim Wilkins"
"Guy Fawkes" <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote in message
news:XnsA26E5E2E8C602Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116...
> rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote in news:bdojtrFhsm1U1
> @mid.individual.net:
>
>> Guy Fawkes wrote:
>>
>>> Well the real pioneer was RAF Bomber Command. Unfortunately I am
>>> of the
>>> opinion that Harris was quite wrong in his approach. A more
>>> targeted
>>> campaign, better coordianted with the USAAF would have been more
>>> effective.
>>>
>>
>> Bomber Harris was just your common garden variety Brit war
>> criminal. If
>> there is a hell, maybe he'll get a taste of what he wrought.
>
> I cannot disagree. He was insubordinate to the Commander of the Air
> Force
> and even to Churchill. He should have been sacked.
In his feeble defense British night bombing accuracy was so poor that
they had no alternative, other than allowing the Americans all the
credit. It was bad enough that we were accomplishing a task they had
declared impossible.
Sometimes luck, good weather and their efforts with radio guide beams
and ground radar gave them results comparable to our daylight
accuracy, but even as late as March 1944 they could miss a major city
by 60 miles.
http://samilitaryhistory.org/vol043lf.html
"...and 48 crews took back clear bombing photographs - of
Schweinfurt!" (56 miles away)
"Thirteen other bombers released their loads when they realized they
were lost; these fell on unspecified targets, including Bamberg, 30
miles north of Nuremberg, and a small town 60 miles north."
-jsw
== 3 of 7 ==
Date: Sun, Nov 3 2013 7:51 am
From: pyotr filipivich
Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> on Sun, 03 Nov 2013 20:11:24 -0800
typed in misc.survivalism the following:
>On Sun, 03 Nov 2013 19:37:52 -0800, pyotr filipivich
><phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>Sam <Sam@nomail.com> on Sun, 03 Nov 2013 12:02:09 -0600 typed in
>>misc.survivalism the following:
>>>You fucking hypocrites . When girly men like Busch Lite murders
>>>woman and children by the millions using carpet bombing while
>>>playing golf with OBL inlaws you call them strong yet when a Black
>>>Muslim from Kenya does it better you call it sick.
>>>
>>>http://mbworld.org/forums/attachments/political-discussions/246044d1351100097-presidents-apology-tour-you-decide-bush_prince_abdullah_kiss_hold_hands.jpg
>>>
>>>Real Americans know Busch Lite enjoyed tonguing
>>>a Saudi muslin.
>>>
>>>hahahaha
>>
>> Wow, that is some acid you got.
>>
>> I mean, yo obviously went so far into the fields of poppies
>>(poppies! Poppies! Poppies!) that even the Wizard couldn't find you
>>with a Geiger counter or blood hounds.
>>
>> Man, you are really not pulling in too many stations on the old
>>antennae. You might want to try something else when you log back into
>>Obama care.gov
>
>I was thinking Sammi was nothing more than scummy Leftwing troll..but
>reading his spew has made it clear that the boi is
>really...really...really mentally ill. Bug fucking nutz. A wack job.
>Fugazzi. Utterly blown his head gasket and all the vacuum has bled
>off.
Too much LDS in the sixties.
Went for a ride on the Yellow Submarine and failed to resurface.
etc., etc, und so weiter.
pyotr
--
pyotr filipivich.
Just about the time you finally see light at the end of the tunnel,
you find out it's a Government Project to build more tunnel.
== 4 of 7 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 9:23 am
From: RD Sandman
Guy Fawkes <No_email_for_you@wahoo.com> wrote in
news:XnsA26DE37074988Wereofftoseethewizrd@78.46.70.116:
> RD Sandman <rdsandman[remove]comcast.net> wrote in
> news:XnsA26D97DE0FB8DHopewell@216.196.121.131:
>
>> Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:ejid79lpdmv93b8f4hv6gccot80isren3n@4ax.com:
>>
>>> On Sun, 03 Nov 2013 12:02:09 -0600, Sam <Sam@nomail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>You fucking hypocrites . When girly men like Busch Lite murders
>>>>woman and children by the millions using carpet bombing
>>>
>>> Carpet bombing? On which planet did this happen? Be specific. Use
>>> all the white space you need.
>>
>> Well, there was some done in WWII. Like the fire bombing on Tokyo
>> and Yokohama. I don't think Bush was president then. I believe it
>> was FDR
> and
>> Truman. ;)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> Well the real pioneer was RAF Bomber Command. Unfortunately I am of
> the opinion that Harris was quite wrong in his approach. A more
> targeted campaign, better coordianted with the USAAF would have been
> more effective.
>
> In Japan it worked well, but for reasons specific to Japanese cities
> and Japanese methods of production.
>
Actually paper houses.
--
Sleep well tonight.......
RD (The Sandman}
One bullet in the possession of a criminal is too many.....
Ten bullets in the possession of a mother trying to protect
her children....may not be enough.
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== 5 of 7 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 9:24 am
From: RD Sandman
pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote in
news:d14e79tv8ib3guiqfqir8jgouli2naa893@4ax.com:
> RD Sandman <rdsandman[remove]comcast.net> on Sun, 03 Nov 2013 16:55:44
> -0600 typed in misc.survivalism the following:
>>Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in
>>news:ejid79lpdmv93b8f4hv6gccot80isren3n@4ax.com:
>>
>>> On Sun, 03 Nov 2013 12:02:09 -0600, Sam <Sam@nomail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>You fucking hypocrites . When girly men like Busch Lite murders
>>>>woman and children by the millions using carpet bombing
>>>
>>> Carpet bombing? On which planet did this happen? Be specific. Use
>>> all the white space you need.
>>
>>Well, there was some done in WWII. Like the fire bombing on Tokyo and
>>Yokohama. I don't think Bush was president then. I believe it was FDR
>>and Truman. ;)
>
> Wrong kind of "carpet bombing". Sam the sham had a flashback of
> the Anhuser-Busch Brewing Company dropping large numbers of carpets on
> the Pepperland - err - Afghanistan.
>
> He really needs ... something. And to sign up for ObamaCare.
> STAT.
>
>
;)
--
Sleep well tonight.......
RD (The Sandman}
One bullet in the possession of a criminal is too many.....
Ten bullets in the possession of a mother trying to protect
her children....may not be enough.
---
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== 6 of 7 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 10:22 am
From: "Jim Wilkins"
"RD Sandman" <rdsandman[remove]comcast.net> wrote in message
news:XnsA26E5F8C6EB52Hopewell@216.196.121.131...
>> In Japan it worked well, but for reasons specific to Japanese
>> cities
>> and Japanese methods of production.
>>
>
> Actually paper houses.
>
> RD (The Sandman}
There is a photo that I haven't found online showing a forest of drill
presses standing in the remains of a burned-out residential area. It
was used to justify area bombing to destroy the dispersed war
production there.
-Curtis LeMay
== 7 of 7 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 10:31 am
From: RD Sandman
"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote in news:l58oj2$vjs$1@dont-
email.me:
> "RD Sandman" <rdsandman[remove]comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:XnsA26E5F8C6EB52Hopewell@216.196.121.131...
>>> In Japan it worked well, but for reasons specific to Japanese
>>> cities
>>> and Japanese methods of production.
>>>
>>
>> Actually paper houses.
>>
>> RD (The Sandman}
>
> There is a photo that I haven't found online showing a forest of drill
> presses standing in the remains of a burned-out residential area. It
> was used to justify area bombing to destroy the dispersed war
> production there.
>
> -Curtis LeMay
Curtis LeMay was looking for a photo online in 1945? The internet was a
tad young then....Al Gore hadn't invented it.
--
Sleep well tonight.......
RD (The Sandman}
One bullet in the possession of a criminal is too many.....
Ten bullets in the possession of a mother trying to protect
her children....may not be enough.
---
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Food stamps cut by 5 billion dollars...
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8ece202a1d5b98bf?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 7:31 am
From: MarkA
On Sun, 03 Nov 2013 19:11:37 +0100, Brian Eaton wrote:
> In article <l55t7g71sdj@news6.newsguy.com> MarkA
> <someone@somewhere.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> The food stamp program is being cut by five BILLION dollars because, you
>> know, the FOUR HUNDRED people who own more than HALF THE WEALTH of the
>> USA shouldn't have to suffer just because millions of families are on
>> the brink of starvation.
>
> It's not being cut you simpleton. The funding for the increase OBAMA used
> to buy his election ran out and the DEMOCRATS FAILED to renew it.
What is the basis of your statement that the DEMOCRATS FAILED to renew it?
Last I checked, the House was being controlled by the Republicans, who
thought it was worth shutting down the government for a week to
demonstrate that they still haven't gotten over the fact that Obamacare
was passed into law.
>
>> How is it even possible that, with a wealth gap so obscenely wide,
>> taking billions of dollars from the poorest Americans hasn't sparked a
>> national outrage??? How is it that so many people still believe the
>> GOP/Fox News/ Tea Party BULLSHIT that "welfare moochers" are what's
>> dragging down the economy?
>
> Because stupid people like you never investigate further than the
> surface.
>
>> The irony is that the people most vocal about the evils of "socialism"
>
> The irony is that most liberals are so ignorant and helpless that they
> might as well be socialists.
>
> First, it was the Head Start program, now it's the Supplemental
> Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP), or food stamps. Studies indicate
> that these programs are, at best, ineffective. Yet, we taxpayers are
> forced to continue to fund/support them.
Please define "ineffective". It seems to me that helping people put food
on their table is not only "effective", but pretty important.
>
> That SNAP, or food stamps, has expanded under "Dear Leader" Barack
> Hussein Obama is not debatable. In fact, a report released in September
> 2012, by the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) showed that about 45
> million individuals are now enrolled in the food stamp program, more
> than double the number that were enrolled in 2003, when George Walker
> Bush was president. We taxpayers spent, in FY2012, a record $80.4
> billion on SNAP, or food stamps, an increase of $2.7 billion over
> FY2011. Further, according to Senator Jeff Sessions (R-AL), food stamp
> spending has increased by 100 percent during the Obama reign. And, food
> stamp recipients have increased by an average of 11,133 per day under
> Obama.
Yes, there is that thing about all the economic growth of the past decade
going to the top 1%, who need it the least. The GOP has insisted on
favoring the ultra-wealthy, and you complain that more people need food
stamps? As I asked before, what is wrong with you people???
>
> So, what? We already knew that. Well, the above becomes quite relevant
> in light of a new National Academy of Science (NAS) study.
>
> The NAS study questions the effectiveness of SNAP. The USDA commissioned
> the study to help it determine the best way to assess whether food
> stamps benefits are allowing families to have a healthy diet. And guess
> what the study found! SNAP does not take into account many barriers to
> finding affordable food by inner-city shoppers. Specific study findings
> include:
>
> "Lack of affordable supermarkets in many cities means that urban
> dwellers, who represent a high proportion of those in poverty, must pay
> more for healthy foods. Food stamps are intended for cheap basic
> ingredients and unprocessed foods. "By failing to account for the fact
> that SNAP participants, like other households, need to purchase
> value-added foods that save preparation time, the current value of the
> SNAP allotment substantially limits the flexibility and purchasing power
> of SNAP benefits."
There is no doubt that poverty, urban decay, etc, are complex problems
that may not have any solution, let alone an easy one. However, I don't
think that means that ignoring the plight of children without enough food
is an appropriate response, especially when the wealth gap has grown to
such obscene size.
>
> "The study questioned formulas used to determine how much benefit each
> family receives. USDA assumes families will spend 30 percent of their
> incomes on food, when in fact most can afford to spend only 13 percent
> given rising costs for housing and healthcare. The study concluded that
> as the families' incomes rise, the government reduces their benefits too
> sharply.
The response to this, then, would be to INCREASE food stamps, not cut
them.
>
> "There is a 16-month lag between when the USDA assesses the cost of
> food and when it adjusts benefit amounts. "Because of the impact of
> inflation and other factors on food prices, this lag in the benefit
> adjustment can significantly reduce the purchasing power of SNAP
> allotments."
>
> While I cannot find the original study (can AT readers help me here?), I
> can find many references to the study. All references do not mention how
> the USDA plans to address a critical SNAP issue: fraud. Food stamp
> recipients are stealing from the government for about $750 million
> yearly by illegally selling their EBT food stamps cards for cash. Most
> fraud occurs when retailers allow customers to turn in their EBT food
> stamps cards for a cash value less than the worth of the EBT cards.
> Sellers even advertise on eBay and/or Craigslist.
Any large, complex system will have cheaters; that's basic game theory.
Again, however, I don't believe that punishing the honest ones is a proper
solution. YMMV.
>
> That "always objective" source, MediaMatters, lamented in April 2012,
> that a 2009 USDA study was all but ignored by the MSM. Al Sharpton, the
> April 10 edition of MSNBC's PoliticsNation said "A new government study
> shows that food stamps have lowered the poverty rate by nearly eight
> percent in 2009." Sharpton was the only MSM source to mention the study.
> The same article cites the study: The study released on April 9,
> "Alleviating Poverty in the United States: The Critical Role of SNAP
> Benefits," explored how SNAP affected "poverty from 2000 to 2009." The
> study found "an average decline of 4.4 percent in the prevalence of
> poverty due to SNAP benefits, while the average decline in the depth and
> severity of poverty was 10.3 and 13.2 percent, respectively." Further,
> the article says, "SNAP's antipoverty effect was strongest in 2009, when
> benefit increases were authorized by the American Recovery and
> Reinvestment Act (ARRA), also known as the stimulus package."
>
> Reducing poverty is, in and of itself, a great goal. But throwing money
> at the problem, and increasing the number of participants, is not the
> answer. The Democrats, through SNAP, accomplishes both objectives.
>
> But nowhere in the MediaMatters article can I find any reference to this
> article which proposes a link between receiving food stamps and being
> overweight. Jay Zagorsky, a research scientist at Ohio State
> University's Center for Human Resource Research, said:
>
> "We can't prove that the Food Stamp Program causes weight gain, but this
> study suggests a strong linkage. While food stamps may help fight
> hunger, they may have the unintended consequence of encouraging weight
> gain among women."
Poverty is clearly associated with obesity, except when people are
actually starving to death, as in places like Ethiopia. Some have
suggested that it may be a response to chronic stress. Again, however,
denying food to hungry children in a country that has plenty of wealth
is, to my way of thinking, unconscionable.
>
> Zagorsky's study also found "that people's Body Mass Index (BMI)
> increased faster when they were on food stamps than when they were not,
> and increased more the longer they were in the program." The USDA itself
> admits that "... nonelderly women, who account for 28 percent of the
> food stamp caseload, some evidence suggests that participation in the
> Food Stamp Program may increase BMI and the probability of obesity."
> Don't you just love how the USDA hides behind the phrase "some evidence
> suggests"?
>
> By the way, statistics and studies never "prove" anything. They only
> suggest what is really going on in the population of interest, in this
> case, ALL food stamp recipients. Zagorsky says that his study "suggests
> a strong linkage" between food stamps receipt/use and weight gain is his
> interpretation of the findings of his study. But the USDA, as
> illustrated above, says that "some evidence suggests." We have two
> interpretations of the same study. So, we must look at WHO is providing
> the interpretations and whether the parties involved have a vested
> interest or not.
>
> Zagorsky works for the Center for Human Resource Research at Ohio State
> University. I can find nothing that links the Center directly to USDA.
> However, the USDA looked at the same study, yet it could not find a
> "strong linkage." All the USDA could find was a "suggestion." Same
> study, same data, different interpretations. Who has the vested interest
> here? Whose budget continuation (or increase) depends upon a favorable
> (or not negative) interpretation? It certainly isn't Zagorsky!
> Zagorsky's study was conclusive in its findings about nonelderly women.
The "government agencies are overstating the magnitude of the problem to
get more funding" is a pretty lame argument in any setting.
>
> And, yet, we taxpayers continue to spend billions of dollars each year
> on a dysfunctional SNAP, while some "fixes" can be accomplished by the
> USDA without increasing SNAP costs. Again, I have to ask: If Obama is
> truly serious about deficit reduction (as he contends), then WHY, other
> than purely for political reasons, not start with SNAP? Or at least
> reorganize the program so that it is effective and we taxpayers get some
> value for the money (that we don't have, that we have to borrow) we are
> forced to spend on SNAP.
>
> But that's just my opinion.
>
> Dr. Beatty earned a Ph.D. in quantitative management and statistics from
> Florida State University. He was a (very conservative) professor of
> quantitative management specializing in using statistics to
> assist/support decision-making. He has been a consultant to many small
> businesses and is now retired. Dr. Beatty is a veteran who served in the
> U.S. Army for 22 years. He blogs at rwno.limewebs.com.
Thank you for a well reasoned, well documented response. You have clearly
given this problem some careful thought. However, what you have provided
is documentation that SNAP isn't perfect, may have detrimental/unintended
effects when viewed as one piece of a complex system, and doesn't
fix every problem. You have no disagreement from me on any of those
points. That being said, I stand by my original statement: in a country
where 0.0001% of the population holds more than 50% of the wealth, trying
to reduce the deficit by cutting programs that provide food to the
neediest segment of society is criminal. For decades, I have listened to
the GOP insist that they will not stand for any tax increases under any
circumstances. It seems to me that that is unrealistic and undesirable.
The current taxation/regulatory rules in this country have made it
possible for the wealthy to increase their wealth very easily. That
constitutes a positive feed-back loop. Such a system is inherently
unstable and unsustainable. Complex, stable systems are characterized by
negative feed-back loops: the further you move away from a "set point",
the more difficult it becomes to move even further away. In economic
terms, that would mean that our "system" should be designed so that the
richer you get, the harder it should be to continue to get richer. Also,
the poorer you are, the harder it should be to get even poorer.
That doesn't mean that the rich can't be rich, and the poor can't be
poor. Humans survived and prospered on the African savanna because they
helped each other. We now have a government that favors the interests of
the ultra-wealthy to the exclusion of everyone else. In my ever humble
opinion, that is the problem that needs to be addressed.
--
MarkA
Keeper of Things Put There Only Just The Night Before
About eight o'clock
==============================================================================
TOPIC: This may be of some iinterest....
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/18a5e6c1f118f8b3?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 7:41 am
From: KickingaLyingAss@test.com
On Sat, 02 Nov 2013 20:02:16 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com>
wrote:
>On Sat, 02 Nov 2013 14:26:40 -0700, KickingaLyingAss@test.com wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 02 Nov 2013 11:14:35 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>>>>>>>http://keys.craigslist.org/boa/4160626596.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Boats of the size asked for run from $5000-15k
>>>2. millions and millions are broke and in debt these days
>>
>>I'm not, and neither are any of my friends. How is it that you can't
>>do what we find so easy? Do you think it might have anything to do
>>with the fact that you aren't willing to get job, and prefer to spend
>>most of your time here telling outrageous lies?
>
>So you are living at the Y then?
Typical non responsive Gunner horsehit that makes my point. You are
broke for good reason. You will remain broke because you're too stupid
and lazy to accept reality, which is that you're the head of a family
of welfare bums crowded into a smoke filled dump that none of you are
willing to clean or paint. Nobody in your shithole has a job and
instead of doing something about it you're online pretending to be a
sailboat expert who knows how to turn a $5k sailboat into a $185k
machine shop. A deal that's so great that the only things you do about
it are insist it's real, and make ridiculous excuses for not jumping
on it yourself. It's absolutely fucking hilarious that you think
anyone would spend one second taking financial advice from you.
Mark R. Wieber (a.k.a. Gunner) Cliff Notes Version 13
Version 13 expands on Wieber's tall tales about military service, adds
some examples of Wieber's creative writing, includes new claims about
gang membership and "leftist" attempts to hack his computer, and
details some of his hilarious statements about his "company" rates and
income.
Below is a collection of links and quotes describing infamous Usenet
troll and death warrant issuer Mark. R. Wieber, a.ka. Gunner or Gunner
Asch.
Wieber has been posting to Usenet since the mid '90s, usually
thousands of times per month. (links to some of his profiles)
http://groups.google.com/groups/profile?enc_user=Orot9hQAAAAVu-i7YM79BqNIPO5iBPiLOPANdqfI6prRsqjc7uCt1A
http://groups.google.com/groups/profile?enc_user=HEaJkBsAAACOrbBANBWNT1XP03_YC9KEwXc63ut3wf6Db8UaObu0tw
http://groups.google.com/groups/profile?enc_user=zKA9NRwAAACtf0cmv8A-iJM5H6Z2Yz6ZIYyGNsfsHA_6Fw_LxpaeDA
His habit is to write tall tales to top anyone he's debating. If his
opponent dares dispute any of the delusions then Wieber follows up
with ever more elaboration and exaggeration. He frequently promises to
put his critics on "the list" so that they will be "hung from lamp
posts" during "the great cull" which is perennially just over the
horizon.
"In less than 3 yrs..the People will kill most/all Leftwingers in an
event known as the Great Cull." (2009)
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.states.iowa/msg/1d494df85841943b
"Because when your death arrives in about 2 yrs..maybe less..the
moments of sheer terror you will experience will be absolutely
marvelous to behold. I hope someone sends me a video tape of your
ending as you are butchered." (2010)
http://groups.google.com/group/talk.politics.guns/msg/feb78d14a2bebf9c
<When will the shooting begin?>
"Late summer" (2012)
http://groups.google.com/group/sac.politics/msg/91995d9e14235ffb
"The Great Cull will do just that after all the gun grabbers and
mentally ill Leftwingers are killed and bulldozed into mass graves in
the very very near future." (2013)
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/468306d38b83c0e9
This tactic is usually accompanied by multiple
detailed descriptions of gory deaths.
"When the People drag you out and hang you from a bit of barbed wire
after kicking you off a lawn chair..Ill be very happy. In fact..I hope
the doers send me a video clip of your ending. Knowing you were
disposed of, along with the many thousands of your bretheren..and
knowing that you will be gone into a mass grave somewhere along with
the rest of the trash who have tried so hard to ruin America..will
allow me to believe that America will indeed survive."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.agnosticism/msg/d175b9b64781e599
-----------------------------------
Wieber likes to fantasize about killing. This example includes a very
lengthy description of impalement.
http://groups.google.com/group/sac.politics/msg/3e720bd5775a70b8
(sample snippets) "So there you are...10 or so feet up in the
air..with a sharp stake up your ass and as time goes by...it pushes
deeper and deeper into your body cavity..any organs that arent pushed
aside..are punctured as you slowly..very slowly slide down the stake"
"Think of the stink that 20,000 writhing, twisting, squirming, wailing
and screaming Leftwingers would make. Glorious! Absolutely
Glorious!"
-------------------------------
Spiritual Wieber
"Im Rensai Buddhist. We are the Buddhists that get to kill bad
people."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.christian/msg/e43f888c326ac288
------------------------------------------
Killer Buddhist Wieber's idea of who is "bad."
"wacking leftists is a patriotic duty."
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.men/msg/c5eeb6c57ae2434f
"So we simply kill them all and periodically weed out those who show a
preference for mental illness and Socialism."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.rush-limbaugh/msg/ae4dcca05cd31580
"Kill the leftists. Its the only way."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/1ce71d4938ea0bdd
"Ive not gutted anyone in a number of years, and Id love to see if I
can still make a man scream as I cut out his guts"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
----------------------------------------
Wieber buries disagreeable visitors with his invisible backhoe!
"I have some of the prettiest places to take people and move them into
their new digs. And a backhoe to do it properly."
http://groups.google.com/group/sac.politics/msg/5e2893d4f968287d
"So when can I expect to need to fire up the backhoe? You have my
address, so bring it on. Now...do you want a northern exposure or a
southern one?"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.rush-limbaugh/msg/02f213f515dbdd75
"my backhoe is fueled!"
http://groups.google.com/group/talk.politics.misc/msg/8ec5e138b751217a
----------------------------------------
The invisible backhoe is stored at Wieber's sinking "high desert"
compound.
"My place is at 1953' " 2011
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.philosophy/xb-fNccOkLs/z1mNPFyT4hQJ
"Actually Im at 1405 feet" 2012
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/talk.politics.guns/RmRrD_slNyk/AHTFS8hOBNMJ
The indisputable reality is low desert, 1032'.
-----------------------------------------
Photos of Wieber
He occasionally posts photos of himself in his clown costumes.
https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Gunner#5230962305767101506
Presumably he imagines it will scare readers into believing he might
shoot them from miles away.
The reality is that he's a Usenet Walter Mitty whose main talent is
slowly culling himself by way of copious infusions of nicotine and
Mountain Dew. He'd have died years ago if not for multiple rescues by
the social welfare system he despises.
https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Bypass#5297722097241260450
The Wieber Inc. company conference table.
https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Newpups#5530249378031142674
The corporate pool in the shop basement.
https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/SepticTank#5537059140372426290
--------------------------
Taxpayers have to save Wieber from the inevitable result of his
lifestyle of heavy smoking, soda and junk food . But he can still do
one handed pullups!
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/1f36c4ad63bee0ac
---------------------------------
Wieber likes to pretend that he lives on ranch acreage, prepared to
survive the apocalypses he constantly warns everyone to fear.
The build-up!!!
"3/4 of an acre"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/cab03648c38ec69b
"I own an acre"
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.econ/msg/74bd2ff85f98cbfd
"Several acres"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/3d5d25863209cdc3
"the empty lot I own to the left. I also own the lot on the
other side of the alley." "Im going to put up a 30x50 steel
building on the empty lot to the left of the house."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.home.repair/msg/745fd34b5e5a19a9
"the other two lots that I own..right next to mine..and behind mine."
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.econ/msg/01785581c332e034
"I own a quarter of an entire block"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics/msg/9806c5ec3716c02c
"I should mention I now have my very own 2500 sq ft warehouse with a 6
Ton over head crane to store Stuff in <G> 2 blocks from my home. With
3 phase."
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/00ea7d74ff7048eb
The let-down :(
"I lease proprety around me."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/92431ffa0db2f641
"Ive got an empty lot beside me that I have permission from the owner"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/82a93aa20527de0d
The Reality
One small .16 acre city lot with a shabby mobile home and tons of
clutter.
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/326-Olive-Ave-Taft-CA-93268/18907159_zpid/
http://goo.gl/maps/TEXoU Google street view
http://www.kcttc.co.kern.ca.us/Payment/ATNDetails.aspx?NUMBER=03930320008&NUM_TYPE=AT&YR=H
County property record, showing decades long struggle to make $100
payments, resulting in many thousands of unpaid taxes and late fees.
(If the link doesn't work, search for 326 Olive, Taft, ATN
039-460-26-00-2)
------------------------------------------
Wieber's treasures overflow onto neighbor's lot that Wieber previously
claimed to own.
"So this morning..she shows up with 2 deputies and advises me that I
have until 2pm Wed afternoon (24 hrs) to clean the lot off else Id be
cited for "illegally dumping" and the county would clean off the lot."
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/886e55dd68ec765b
-----------------------------------------
Wieber claims to be very skilled at many trades. He also insists he's
a hard worker despite the obvious contradiction with all the posting.
"Ive got hummm...3-4 Associates Degrees"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/a526902ea3daeacc
"I repair machinery in machine shops for $75hr, $25hr travel time
(portal to portal) and $0.50 a mile out and back. And Im one of the
cheap guys. And I weld too."
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.engr.joining.welding/msg/fbdfddb82b3ef209
"I made $4k in the last two weeks. Net I own my own company"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.usa.republican/msg/5cf76ac919a364a3
And yet there are a few <ahem> minor contradictions.
"My medical bills? What medical bills? I filed Bankruptcy a couple
months ago. Phoof! All gone!"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.transport.trucking/msg/f58b373e0c864533
"Ive already talked to the IRS about the issue, as well as the
California Franchise Tax Board. They reviewed the data..and gave me a
thumbs up. Since my total assests are less than $60k..home included
...they have Zip interest in taking me to court.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/66f4f601ee528ae6
The evidence is 30 years of liens and judgments.
http://tinyurl.com/d7hkkp http://tinyurl.com/l68gh3
-------------------------------
Wieber's services are in such great demand that "clients" pay him >$40
per hour for driving time and expenses required for him to commute to
"work."
"I get $75 an hour, .55 cents a mile out and back, and $25/hr
travel time."
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/soc.culture.african.american/lFPLlaBDajs/BhcHaszOD98J
At 913 miles per day! the driving alone should pay off handsomely
"Ive never had a car accident in 30 yrs/10 million miles of driving"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/ce00195d4af80a15
Oops, driving tired leads to income shrinkage and inability to use a
calculator
"Last year..and yes..I do bill $75 an hour, plus travel and mileage as
noted..I grossed..grossed $27k before expenses."
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/f9sStUNj09I/Q7j9PH5bLnMJ
----------------------------------------------------
Wieber pretends to be a P.E.
"Son....its called California Advertising. Half the companies out
here dont have a degree. Just someone who owns it good enough to pass
the tests."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/65ee02118cd78d85
Wieber later decides that his "California advertising" was actually
the result of a mysterious fraud!
"It was fascinating though to backtrack who put PE on my "resume" on a
very obscure engineers registry though. A registry that Id never heard
of before the State of California brought it to my attention. A
registry that promptly corrected some ones attempt at fraud..and
gave me the information visa Avis the IP address of the party who did
it. Which I still have..as does the State of California."
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!original/misc.survivalism/xb-fNccOkLs/37P0aaRJ3tcJ
-------------------------------------
Sexual Prowess
"While I once got paid to do a porn..it was over 30 yrs ago..and I
kept my socks on."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/20b709a701b572d9
One of Wieber's many descriptions of sexual conquest and expertise,
this time dating a black Victoria's Secret model.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/76b0aba944fe26da
"I was banging my babysitter when I was 11"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/d26fc90c007efee2
His charming description of one of his secret techniques, wherein he
names his victim.
"Reminds me of Barbara Jenkins. I finally had to teach her the joys
of doing it face down. Then she only clawed the pillows to ragged
debris rather than my back. Ive still got scars 25 yrs later"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/92cccf38b22d36fb
"My ol lady likes to get fucked in the ass now and then, and my
girlfriend can suck a dick like a vacuum cleaner"
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!original/rec.crafts.metalworking/G0GgSLMxfak/efoWSco6pb8J
"The day after I got home from the bypass..I nailed the old lady for 2
hours, going easy of course..still had 174 staples in me. After they
pulled the staples..I nailed one of the lady friends for at least a
couple hours. A good time was had by all."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/272a1377e9d6f006
Listen up ladies: if you find teeth a turn-off then Wieber's your man.
"Im not ashamed to state that I have 9 teeth left. (9)"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/488c6a00c55ffdcf
---------------------------------
Wieber's chronicle of the years 1976-2000. Unrequited love, wife and
kid from hell, trash and bills "sneaking" up for years, etc. In his
own words "disgusting."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/94ecb1feee7c3603
-------------------------------
Wieber's detailed description of his Friends List, a personal army of
"computer wienies," ready to track down his online enemies so that his
other friends can execute the offenders, yada yada.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/51ccf1d67151a862
One of the above mentioned friends, and Wieber's most loyal sycophant
and defender for many years, the fearsome Tom Gardner. (the walrus
shaped one)
http://www.neme-s.org/Oshkosh_2007/Ohio_Brush/DSC02543.JPG
------------------------------------
Wieber, confused veteran
Born Nov. 11, 1953
"Graduates" high school (1970)
"Because fuckwit..I graduated at 16 and a half"
and...
"went into the military after I graduated"
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/misc.survivalism/C_rKZUGPx10/5CvVhEWI4EwJ
"I was in from 71-73. ... I went in when I was 17. Though my birth
certificate said I was 19"
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.military/dW1J0do_Wpg/nSVZcfQENlAJ
but also...
Graduates high school in 1971 Attends college in 1971 and 1974
http://www.mylife.com/markwieber
Fortunately, identity theft solved time travel confusion
"So I pulled a name off a tombstone, got a birth cert..joined up."
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/Z735Yxv7D_Q/d990LYQ96l4J
Another version of his story of serving in Vietnam despite the fact
that he was too young to have enlisted.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.military/msg/503604f47159259d
VA is "helpful" abouit identity theft (2010)
<So you have a DD-214?>
"Of course I do. However its not in my "actual" name. And its tucked
neatly in a footlocker sitting in a cabinet in my dads basement.
And yes..Ive made inquiries to the VA about the situation. They have
been helpful."
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/Z735Yxv7D_Q/kWI0FA0GthYJ
VA is a bitch (2009)
"I wasnt particularly happy with the VA in 1973....wasnt really happy
with the VA in 84...never bothered to go back. No need to. Now Ive got
leftards to take care of me, without any problems whatsoever.
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.machines.cnc/9LO7TQE7c20/usqREDqf0MEJ
Alternate IDs? No problem for the amazing Wieber!
"In fact..I have, quite legally, 3 other packages of ID, all in
different names etc etc, that I keep current. All quite legal, as Im
sure you know. Someday..one might have/want/need to take off into the
wild blue yonder. The only hard part is fingerprints."
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/Z735Yxv7D_Q/d990LYQ96l4J
Some of his explanations for not producing his service
documentation.
"Id have to drive back to my Dads place in Michigan, and dig an old
footlocker out of my piles of stuff to get the dd-214. Its not like I
have a lot of use for it."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/a41c6783dbf70507
"Ayup. Id certainly need to get one. Gonna be in another
name..but..shrug...doable.
Assuming I wanted to open that can of worms again.
So Ill just hang in there and let the Democrats pay my bills.
Works for me!"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/786993f7130f418c
---------------------------------------
Additional accomplishments as a juvenile
"I met Janis that weekend. (March '68) Fugs, Cream, Animals, Byrds etc
etc etc over the next few years. Met most of the big Names in the next
3 yrs"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/9466cc49e1e9e99d
"Which is why I got to march with Dr King in Detroit in June of
1963..at the age of almost..10."
http://groups.google.com/group/or.politics/msg/ff92a4b3bf6990c4
----------------------------------------
Name an occupation and Wieber will claim to have substantial
experience. The trouble is that after so many hundreds of thousands of
posts he can't possibly keep track of who he's one-upped, including
himself.
The amazing Deputy Pinocchio story
"I dabbled as a reserve Deputy for a couple years"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/50864f4b5ffce244
"a reserve Deputy at night (two years)"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/daf6b3de8807600c
"Worked for 5 yrs as a reserve Sheriff's Deputy"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/cab03648c38ec69b
"I was a Deputy for several years in the 70s"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/0f875239e83efa41
"8 yrs on the street as a cop"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics/msg/898e16741f642645
"a number of years as a Deputy Sheriff..and have done bounty hunting
on and off for many years"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
"And Ive known drug dealers for 30 yrs. Most of them are dead or in
prison. Ive arrested some 2500 or more of them over the years."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/5587a26b9180b99b
---------------------------------------
At some point Wieber decided he'd been a paramedic as well.
"As an ex paramedic"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/adbd03a89de3e8be
"Blacksmithing, animal husbandry, "handy man", paramedic, armorer"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/93bdfece55aad274
"Ive been..in Real Life(tm)...everything from a pulp cutter
(lumberjack), to fishing guide, deputy sheriff, Army Ranger, alarm
company Sr. Engineer, Ham Radio hobbyist, CB radio tech, commerical
photographer, competative marksman and pistol combat shooter,
gunsmith, paramedic and a host of other things both as a living and as
hobbies."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.survival/msg/20611c75a80e805c
------------------------------------------------
Wieber demonstrates his writing chops
"visa versa"
http://tinyurl.com/qgpvlc5
---------------------------------------------
Biker gang member Wieber. Is there anything he HASN'T been?
"I rode with a gang for a very short time. Until they got doped up
and decided that the bank in the next town was open and available for
a sudden and unexpected withdrawal. At which point..I removed my
colors, got on my panhead and mosied on down the road."
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.survivalism/_yfNQCHqHjY/XvuInSwiScwJ
--------------------------------------------------
Leftist hackers will never infiltrate Wieber's computer
"Ive had a number of computer attacks by actual people over the
years..typically leftwingers (all unsucessful) so I keep my security a
bit tighter than most folks do."
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/9PulvgnPKAQ/M_zp4hkoug4J
---------------------------------------------------
Wieber's life is better than yours.
"When was the last time you attended a Black Tie dinner function with
the president of a Fortune 500 Company? Last year for me.
When was the last time you sat down over pizza and discussed the
economy with a world class economist? Last month, for me."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/36cd1553d4b2efac
"I own my own business doing engineering etc etc."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
"I can high kick a light bulb out of an 8 ft ceiling fixture"
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!original/rec.crafts.metalworking/DB1Bm1vqU7Y/iGGv6zhvnZYJ
---------------------------------------
History Student Wieber
"Gunner, who IS a student of military history and war"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/49650e55e6e593cf
"eff..stick with Blackstone, ok? Its a bit late to be catching up with
military history. Ive been a student of it for well over 30 yrs"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/e4f456d678fa05d2
"Gunner, student of history"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/7312daff1e449364
"Though I AM a student of history"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/84be46090d3146f7
"Im also a student of not only military history, but geopolitical
history"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.california/msg/4b34eff2cfdde518
<drum roll...>
"Hitler was a Socialist/Fascist just like US liberals"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/fdfacb0e8c4998f4
-------------------------------------
Wieber NEVER stops working (lying).
"In the past 40 yrs..I think Ive been unemployed for a total of
hummm...6 days."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/d9eb24039fa0acfd
"Ive only been unemployed for about 3 months"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.bush/msg/5289d0323c4125cf
All that working, paychecks not so much.
"So I went dumpster diving. And I sat in a house with no gas or
electricity and ate my dumpster food, and shared it with my dogs and
cats. We all were happy to have food. For two weeks."
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/a2ddd7a2af9e6173
----------------------------------------
Do not cross Wieber, he has an army of lawyers ready to issue a
"summins."
"Im sure your provider is going to be real happy to get a phone call
from me, my lawyer, and a couple other folks whom carry a bit of
weight" (2007)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/493fb369d84be771
"My lawyer hates reading between the lines" (2010)
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/f1f0383a30932b60
"Im a big fan of turning them over to the cops along with a signed
statement (having my Lawyer draw it up and deliver it)" (2010)
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.survival/msg/fb3cf3b61873c5fc
"My lawyer will be sending you a summins in the next few weeks or so"
(2011)
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.california/msg/f5b8947d02c618fa
-----------------------------------
Marksman Wieber
"Shooting a coyote in the head at 75 yrd with a handgun is dead
easy."
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/da06ccf3a0e72385
"In my circle..we dont bother to take out a rifle until the range to
ground squirrels gets past 175-200 yrds."
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/e7612d549bdd6b65
"I drag out the rifles when the ranges go over 250 meters when varmint
shooting."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/cf75ae65479ede0f
"...but Ive trained (and actually survived) multiple
targets/assailents, armed with a variety of weapons, over the years.
Ive been shot, stabbed, bayoneted, blown up, bucked off, run over,
thiumped on, clubbed, smashed bashed and generally been abused...but
while Im not as fast as I used to be...I can still punch a .45 round
into multiple targets while keeping at least 2 pieces of brass in the
air at the same time I shot in a combat match Sept 7th of this
year..they put me in with the active military and active police
shooters and I took 1st place. Got yet another dust collector to try
to find a place for. 5 falling plates at 15 yrds in 2.01 seconds.
Slow as molasses for a hot shooter..slow as hell for me in my
prime...but still faster than 99.999 people on the street And that
was not having competed in several years, cold off the street, with my
daily gun and old ammo grabbed out of the junk self. I ran the course
again with a .41 Magnum, full house loads..and my best time was 2.51
seconds. Shrug...one doesnt think..one simply does..muscle memory
does the rest. After shooting at least 1 million rounds out of
handguns alone over the past 30 yrs...."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.survival/msg/814fb94f4af5ed84
--------------------------------
Wieber's even more amazing friends
"A buddy of mine (Ranger) killed a deer once on a $100 bet, with a
ball pein hammer."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/cf75ae65479ede0f
-----------------------------------
Wieber, Macho Mitty. Bears and boar, watch out!
"From about 20 feet. Not a baited bear or dog run bear either. I snuck
up her fair and square. But then..I was used to hunting far more
dangerous game."
"how about wild boar with a bowie knife? Been there, done that."
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/ebb54d1b4f0bedfd
"the last two wild boar and the last 3 deer I harvested were with
handguns. Oh..and second and third elk I took were with handguns."
http://groups.google.com/group/talk.politics.misc/msg/2f45ca9a15826bc3
"I took a boar with an obsidian tipped spear once. "
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.atheism/msg/9637d110cdd03169
"I competed in several pistol competitions and came in 2nd and 3rd,
which included reloading both revolvers and semiautos and killed,
butchered and packed out a number of wild boar with one arm."
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.survival/msg/5aeb44a357a40201
-------------------------------------
Wieber is indestructible!
Ive been treated for injuries as a result of rodeo, motorcycles,
knives, explosive devices, assault. aircraft crashes and motor vehicle
crashes.
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/acebd3f3a912ff2e
--------------------------------------
The stupendous Wieber tops world records!
264 mph motorcycle
http://groups.google.com/group/talk.politics.guns/msg/504734f74873c17f
42 knot Hobie Cat
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/0042848ac1416cbe
2 foot centipede
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/e32c62114ea73910
Drives 10 million miles <913 miles every day for 30 years>
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/ce00195d4af80a15
Only 1 million on "scooters" though.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/7dc2a66a8a53c2d6
-------------------------------------
Self professed animal lover.
Except for beating one dog.
"What he seemed to have a handled on was smoking my cigarrettes, and
guzzling energy drinks like a speed freak when he wasn't downing
Mountain Dew or beating his dog"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/551e94166afc0da2
And hanging another from a choker chain. A redneck classic.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/5e8ae7330e8be437
--------------------
Wieber's funniest lies.
"I never lie"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/0264cc658d2e57fb
"I never lie"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.liberalism/msg/9ef5f530780d8194
"I lied about who I was and how old I was"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/b6421cb4f5a8eb52
<Readers, cage your irony meters>
"I can say with a clear conscience that I dont lie. And I dont.
Ive made a point of it for most of my life. Ever since I discovered
its far far to difficult to remember which lies one tells which person
and it comes back and bites you in the ass."
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/7f633fef7961cc92
---------------------
And in case you couldn't guess, here are some of his IQ stories.
"mid 150s"
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/60beacdc8a0bd420
"In 1971, I was given a battery of tests at Michigan Tech University
(Houghton) and after some head scratching, the chief of testing
declared I had an IQ of 157. They wrote several articles on the
subject and published them somewhere."
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
"165"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/b8b3afb9ad1fd63f
-----------------------
Wieber was/wasn't a Mensa member.
"Was asked to join Mensa, but didnt (proves Im smart) " 2001
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/60beacdc8a0bd420
"Mensa? Been there, done that." 2009
http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
"Certainly not the same Mensa that I belonged to." 2013
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.usa/msg/b5c3c389ba595b74
----------------------------
Wieber hates/loves the Wieber Cliff Notes.
"A great set up for court!!"
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/talk.politics.guns/BfeVyikv-Jo/hvwmn6m4cDEJ
("summins" must be enroute via turtle express)
"a pretty good listing of my accomplishments"
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.survivalism/T0BKEovPmIA/qM2K2lIlG-0J
------------------------------
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 10:25 am
From: Gunner Asch
On Mon, 04 Nov 2013 07:41:58 -0800, KickingaLyingAss@test.com wrote:
>On Sat, 02 Nov 2013 20:02:16 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 02 Nov 2013 14:26:40 -0700, KickingaLyingAss@test.com wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 02 Nov 2013 11:14:35 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>http://keys.craigslist.org/boa/4160626596.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Boats of the size asked for run from $5000-15k
>
>>>>2. millions and millions are broke and in debt these days
>>>
>>>I'm not, and neither are any of my friends. How is it that you can't
>>>do what we find so easy? Do you think it might have anything to do
>>>with the fact that you aren't willing to get job, and prefer to spend
>>>most of your time here telling outrageous lies?
>>
>>So you are living at the Y then?
>
>Typical non responsive Gunner horsehit that makes my point. You are
>broke for good reason. You will remain broke because you're too stupid
>and lazy to accept reality, which is that you're the head of a family
>of welfare bums crowded into a smoke filled dump that none of you are
>willing to clean or paint. Nobody in your shithole has a job and
>instead of doing something about it you're online pretending to be a
>sailboat expert who knows how to turn a $5k sailboat into a $185k
>machine shop. A deal that's so great that the only things you do about
>it are insist it's real, and make ridiculous excuses for not jumping
>on it yourself. It's absolutely fucking hilarious that you think
>anyone would spend one second taking financial advice from you.
>
>Mark R. Wieber (a.k.a. Gunner) Cliff Notes Version 13
>
>Version 13 expands on Wieber's tall tales about military service, adds
>some examples of Wieber's creative writing, includes new claims about
>gang membership and "leftist" attempts to hack his computer, and
>details some of his hilarious statements about his "company" rates and
>income.
>
>Below is a collection of links and quotes describing infamous Usenet
>troll and death warrant issuer Mark. R. Wieber, a.ka. Gunner or Gunner
>Asch.
>
>Wieber has been posting to Usenet since the mid '90s, usually
>thousands of times per month. (links to some of his profiles)
>http://groups.google.com/groups/profile?enc_user=Orot9hQAAAAVu-i7YM79BqNIPO5iBPiLOPANdqfI6prRsqjc7uCt1A
>http://groups.google.com/groups/profile?enc_user=HEaJkBsAAACOrbBANBWNT1XP03_YC9KEwXc63ut3wf6Db8UaObu0tw
>http://groups.google.com/groups/profile?enc_user=zKA9NRwAAACtf0cmv8A-iJM5H6Z2Yz6ZIYyGNsfsHA_6Fw_LxpaeDA
>His habit is to write tall tales to top anyone he's debating. If his
>opponent dares dispute any of the delusions then Wieber follows up
>with ever more elaboration and exaggeration. He frequently promises to
>put his critics on "the list" so that they will be "hung from lamp
>posts" during "the great cull" which is perennially just over the
>horizon.
>
>"In less than 3 yrs..the People will kill most/all Leftwingers in an
>event known as the Great Cull." (2009)
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.states.iowa/msg/1d494df85841943b
>
>"Because when your death arrives in about 2 yrs..maybe less..the
>moments of sheer terror you will experience will be absolutely
>marvelous to behold. I hope someone sends me a video tape of your
>ending as you are butchered." (2010)
>http://groups.google.com/group/talk.politics.guns/msg/feb78d14a2bebf9c
>
><When will the shooting begin?>
>"Late summer" (2012)
>http://groups.google.com/group/sac.politics/msg/91995d9e14235ffb
>
>"The Great Cull will do just that after all the gun grabbers and
>mentally ill Leftwingers are killed and bulldozed into mass graves in
>the very very near future." (2013)
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/468306d38b83c0e9
>
>This tactic is usually accompanied by multiple
>detailed descriptions of gory deaths.
>
>"When the People drag you out and hang you from a bit of barbed wire
>after kicking you off a lawn chair..Ill be very happy. In fact..I hope
>the doers send me a video clip of your ending. Knowing you were
>disposed of, along with the many thousands of your bretheren..and
>knowing that you will be gone into a mass grave somewhere along with
>the rest of the trash who have tried so hard to ruin America..will
>allow me to believe that America will indeed survive."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.agnosticism/msg/d175b9b64781e599
>-----------------------------------
>
>Wieber likes to fantasize about killing. This example includes a very
>lengthy description of impalement.
>http://groups.google.com/group/sac.politics/msg/3e720bd5775a70b8
>(sample snippets) "So there you are...10 or so feet up in the
>air..with a sharp stake up your ass and as time goes by...it pushes
>deeper and deeper into your body cavity..any organs that arent pushed
>aside..are punctured as you slowly..very slowly slide down the stake"
>"Think of the stink that 20,000 writhing, twisting, squirming, wailing
>and screaming Leftwingers would make. Glorious! Absolutely
>Glorious!"
>-------------------------------
>
>Spiritual Wieber
>
>"Im Rensai Buddhist. We are the Buddhists that get to kill bad
>people."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.christian/msg/e43f888c326ac288
>------------------------------------------
>
>Killer Buddhist Wieber's idea of who is "bad."
>
>"wacking leftists is a patriotic duty."
>http://groups.google.com/group/soc.men/msg/c5eeb6c57ae2434f
>
>"So we simply kill them all and periodically weed out those who show a
>preference for mental illness and Socialism."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.rush-limbaugh/msg/ae4dcca05cd31580
>
>"Kill the leftists. Its the only way."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/1ce71d4938ea0bdd
>
>"Ive not gutted anyone in a number of years, and Id love to see if I
>can still make a man scream as I cut out his guts"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
>----------------------------------------
>
>Wieber buries disagreeable visitors with his invisible backhoe!
>
>"I have some of the prettiest places to take people and move them into
>their new digs. And a backhoe to do it properly."
>http://groups.google.com/group/sac.politics/msg/5e2893d4f968287d
>
>"So when can I expect to need to fire up the backhoe? You have my
>address, so bring it on. Now...do you want a northern exposure or a
>southern one?"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.rush-limbaugh/msg/02f213f515dbdd75
>
>"my backhoe is fueled!"
>http://groups.google.com/group/talk.politics.misc/msg/8ec5e138b751217a
>----------------------------------------
>
>The invisible backhoe is stored at Wieber's sinking "high desert"
>compound.
>
>"My place is at 1953' " 2011
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.philosophy/xb-fNccOkLs/z1mNPFyT4hQJ
>
>"Actually Im at 1405 feet" 2012
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/talk.politics.guns/RmRrD_slNyk/AHTFS8hOBNMJ
>
>The indisputable reality is low desert, 1032'.
>-----------------------------------------
>
>Photos of Wieber
>
>He occasionally posts photos of himself in his clown costumes.
>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Gunner#5230962305767101506
>Presumably he imagines it will scare readers into believing he might
>shoot them from miles away.
>
>The reality is that he's a Usenet Walter Mitty whose main talent is
>slowly culling himself by way of copious infusions of nicotine and
>Mountain Dew. He'd have died years ago if not for multiple rescues by
>the social welfare system he despises.
>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Bypass#5297722097241260450
>
>The Wieber Inc. company conference table.
>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/Newpups#5530249378031142674
>
>The corporate pool in the shop basement.
>https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/SepticTank#5537059140372426290
>--------------------------
>
>Taxpayers have to save Wieber from the inevitable result of his
>lifestyle of heavy smoking, soda and junk food . But he can still do
>one handed pullups!
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/1f36c4ad63bee0ac
>---------------------------------
>
>Wieber likes to pretend that he lives on ranch acreage, prepared to
>survive the apocalypses he constantly warns everyone to fear.
>
>The build-up!!!
>
>"3/4 of an acre"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/cab03648c38ec69b
>
>"I own an acre"
>http://groups.google.com/group/sci.econ/msg/74bd2ff85f98cbfd
>
>"Several acres"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/3d5d25863209cdc3
>
>"the empty lot I own to the left. I also own the lot on the
>other side of the alley." "Im going to put up a 30x50 steel
>building on the empty lot to the left of the house."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.home.repair/msg/745fd34b5e5a19a9
>
>"the other two lots that I own..right next to mine..and behind mine."
>http://groups.google.com/group/sci.econ/msg/01785581c332e034
>
>"I own a quarter of an entire block"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics/msg/9806c5ec3716c02c
>
>"I should mention I now have my very own 2500 sq ft warehouse with a 6
>Ton over head crane to store Stuff in <G> 2 blocks from my home. With
>3 phase."
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/00ea7d74ff7048eb
>
>
>The let-down :(
>
>"I lease proprety around me."
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/92431ffa0db2f641
>
>"Ive got an empty lot beside me that I have permission from the owner"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/82a93aa20527de0d
>
>The Reality
>
>One small .16 acre city lot with a shabby mobile home and tons of
>clutter.
>http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/326-Olive-Ave-Taft-CA-93268/18907159_zpid/
>http://goo.gl/maps/TEXoU Google street view
>http://www.kcttc.co.kern.ca.us/Payment/ATNDetails.aspx?NUMBER=03930320008&NUM_TYPE=AT&YR=H
>County property record, showing decades long struggle to make $100
>payments, resulting in many thousands of unpaid taxes and late fees.
>(If the link doesn't work, search for 326 Olive, Taft, ATN
>039-460-26-00-2)
>------------------------------------------
>
>Wieber's treasures overflow onto neighbor's lot that Wieber previously
>claimed to own.
>
>"So this morning..she shows up with 2 deputies and advises me that I
>have until 2pm Wed afternoon (24 hrs) to clean the lot off else Id be
>cited for "illegally dumping" and the county would clean off the lot."
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/886e55dd68ec765b
>-----------------------------------------
>
>Wieber claims to be very skilled at many trades. He also insists he's
>a hard worker despite the obvious contradiction with all the posting.
>
>
>"Ive got hummm...3-4 Associates Degrees"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/a526902ea3daeacc
>
>"I repair machinery in machine shops for $75hr, $25hr travel time
>(portal to portal) and $0.50 a mile out and back. And Im one of the
>cheap guys. And I weld too."
>http://groups.google.com/group/sci.engr.joining.welding/msg/fbdfddb82b3ef209
>
>"I made $4k in the last two weeks. Net I own my own company"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.usa.republican/msg/5cf76ac919a364a3
>
>And yet there are a few <ahem> minor contradictions.
>
>"My medical bills? What medical bills? I filed Bankruptcy a couple
>months ago. Phoof! All gone!"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.transport.trucking/msg/f58b373e0c864533
>
>"Ive already talked to the IRS about the issue, as well as the
>California Franchise Tax Board. They reviewed the data..and gave me a
>thumbs up. Since my total assests are less than $60k..home included
>...they have Zip interest in taking me to court.
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/66f4f601ee528ae6
>
>The evidence is 30 years of liens and judgments.
>http://tinyurl.com/d7hkkp http://tinyurl.com/l68gh3
>-------------------------------
>
>Wieber's services are in such great demand that "clients" pay him >$40
>per hour for driving time and expenses required for him to commute to
>"work."
>
>"I get $75 an hour, .55 cents a mile out and back, and $25/hr
>travel time."
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/soc.culture.african.american/lFPLlaBDajs/BhcHaszOD98J
>
>At 913 miles per day! the driving alone should pay off handsomely
>
>"Ive never had a car accident in 30 yrs/10 million miles of driving"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/ce00195d4af80a15
>
>Oops, driving tired leads to income shrinkage and inability to use a
>calculator
>
>"Last year..and yes..I do bill $75 an hour, plus travel and mileage as
>noted..I grossed..grossed $27k before expenses."
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/f9sStUNj09I/Q7j9PH5bLnMJ
>----------------------------------------------------
>
>Wieber pretends to be a P.E.
>
>"Son....its called California Advertising. Half the companies out
>here dont have a degree. Just someone who owns it good enough to pass
>the tests."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/65ee02118cd78d85
>
>
>Wieber later decides that his "California advertising" was actually
>the result of a mysterious fraud!
>
>"It was fascinating though to backtrack who put PE on my "resume" on a
>very obscure engineers registry though. A registry that Id never heard
>of before the State of California brought it to my attention. A
>registry that promptly corrected some ones attempt at fraud..and
>gave me the information visa Avis the IP address of the party who did
>it. Which I still have..as does the State of California."
>https://groups.google.com/forum/#!original/misc.survivalism/xb-fNccOkLs/37P0aaRJ3tcJ
>-------------------------------------
>
>Sexual Prowess
>
>"While I once got paid to do a porn..it was over 30 yrs ago..and I
>kept my socks on."
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/20b709a701b572d9
>
>One of Wieber's many descriptions of sexual conquest and expertise,
>this time dating a black Victoria's Secret model.
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/76b0aba944fe26da
>
>"I was banging my babysitter when I was 11"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/d26fc90c007efee2
>
>His charming description of one of his secret techniques, wherein he
>names his victim.
>
>"Reminds me of Barbara Jenkins. I finally had to teach her the joys
>of doing it face down. Then she only clawed the pillows to ragged
>debris rather than my back. Ive still got scars 25 yrs later"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/92cccf38b22d36fb
>
>"My ol lady likes to get fucked in the ass now and then, and my
>girlfriend can suck a dick like a vacuum cleaner"
>https://groups.google.com/forum/#!original/rec.crafts.metalworking/G0GgSLMxfak/efoWSco6pb8J
>
>"The day after I got home from the bypass..I nailed the old lady for 2
>hours, going easy of course..still had 174 staples in me. After they
>pulled the staples..I nailed one of the lady friends for at least a
>couple hours. A good time was had by all."
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/272a1377e9d6f006
>
>Listen up ladies: if you find teeth a turn-off then Wieber's your man.
>
>"Im not ashamed to state that I have 9 teeth left. (9)"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/488c6a00c55ffdcf
>---------------------------------
>
>Wieber's chronicle of the years 1976-2000. Unrequited love, wife and
>kid from hell, trash and bills "sneaking" up for years, etc. In his
>own words "disgusting."
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/94ecb1feee7c3603
>-------------------------------
>
>Wieber's detailed description of his Friends List, a personal army of
>"computer wienies," ready to track down his online enemies so that his
>other friends can execute the offenders, yada yada.
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/51ccf1d67151a862
>
>One of the above mentioned friends, and Wieber's most loyal sycophant
>and defender for many years, the fearsome Tom Gardner. (the walrus
>shaped one)
>http://www.neme-s.org/Oshkosh_2007/Ohio_Brush/DSC02543.JPG
>------------------------------------
>
>Wieber, confused veteran
>
>Born Nov. 11, 1953
>
>"Graduates" high school (1970)
>"Because fuckwit..I graduated at 16 and a half"
>
>and...
>
>"went into the military after I graduated"
>https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/misc.survivalism/C_rKZUGPx10/5CvVhEWI4EwJ
>
>"I was in from 71-73. ... I went in when I was 17. Though my birth
>certificate said I was 19"
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.military/dW1J0do_Wpg/nSVZcfQENlAJ
>
>but also...
>
>Graduates high school in 1971 Attends college in 1971 and 1974
>http://www.mylife.com/markwieber
>
>Fortunately, identity theft solved time travel confusion
>
>"So I pulled a name off a tombstone, got a birth cert..joined up."
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/Z735Yxv7D_Q/d990LYQ96l4J
>
>Another version of his story of serving in Vietnam despite the fact
>that he was too young to have enlisted.
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.military/msg/503604f47159259d
>
>VA is "helpful" abouit identity theft (2010)
>
><So you have a DD-214?>
>"Of course I do. However its not in my "actual" name. And its tucked
>neatly in a footlocker sitting in a cabinet in my dads basement.
>And yes..Ive made inquiries to the VA about the situation. They have
>been helpful."
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/Z735Yxv7D_Q/kWI0FA0GthYJ
>
>VA is a bitch (2009)
>
>"I wasnt particularly happy with the VA in 1973....wasnt really happy
>with the VA in 84...never bothered to go back. No need to. Now Ive got
>leftards to take care of me, without any problems whatsoever.
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.machines.cnc/9LO7TQE7c20/usqREDqf0MEJ
>
>Alternate IDs? No problem for the amazing Wieber!
>
>"In fact..I have, quite legally, 3 other packages of ID, all in
>different names etc etc, that I keep current. All quite legal, as Im
>sure you know. Someday..one might have/want/need to take off into the
>wild blue yonder. The only hard part is fingerprints."
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/Z735Yxv7D_Q/d990LYQ96l4J
>
>
>Some of his explanations for not producing his service
>documentation.
>
>"Id have to drive back to my Dads place in Michigan, and dig an old
>footlocker out of my piles of stuff to get the dd-214. Its not like I
>have a lot of use for it."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/a41c6783dbf70507
>
>"Ayup. Id certainly need to get one. Gonna be in another
>name..but..shrug...doable.
>Assuming I wanted to open that can of worms again.
>So Ill just hang in there and let the Democrats pay my bills.
>Works for me!"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/786993f7130f418c
>---------------------------------------
>
>Additional accomplishments as a juvenile
>
>"I met Janis that weekend. (March '68) Fugs, Cream, Animals, Byrds etc
>etc etc over the next few years. Met most of the big Names in the next
>3 yrs"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/9466cc49e1e9e99d
>
>"Which is why I got to march with Dr King in Detroit in June of
>1963..at the age of almost..10."
>http://groups.google.com/group/or.politics/msg/ff92a4b3bf6990c4
>----------------------------------------
>
>Name an occupation and Wieber will claim to have substantial
>experience. The trouble is that after so many hundreds of thousands of
>posts he can't possibly keep track of who he's one-upped, including
>himself.
>
>The amazing Deputy Pinocchio story
>
>"I dabbled as a reserve Deputy for a couple years"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/50864f4b5ffce244
>
>"a reserve Deputy at night (two years)"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/daf6b3de8807600c
>
>"Worked for 5 yrs as a reserve Sheriff's Deputy"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/cab03648c38ec69b
>
>"I was a Deputy for several years in the 70s"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/0f875239e83efa41
>
>"8 yrs on the street as a cop"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics/msg/898e16741f642645
>
>"a number of years as a Deputy Sheriff..and have done bounty hunting
>on and off for many years"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
>
>"And Ive known drug dealers for 30 yrs. Most of them are dead or in
>prison. Ive arrested some 2500 or more of them over the years."
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/5587a26b9180b99b
>---------------------------------------
>
>At some point Wieber decided he'd been a paramedic as well.
>
>"As an ex paramedic"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/adbd03a89de3e8be
>
>"Blacksmithing, animal husbandry, "handy man", paramedic, armorer"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/93bdfece55aad274
>
>"Ive been..in Real Life(tm)...everything from a pulp cutter
>(lumberjack), to fishing guide, deputy sheriff, Army Ranger, alarm
>company Sr. Engineer, Ham Radio hobbyist, CB radio tech, commerical
>photographer, competative marksman and pistol combat shooter,
>gunsmith, paramedic and a host of other things both as a living and as
>hobbies."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.survival/msg/20611c75a80e805c
>------------------------------------------------
>
>Wieber demonstrates his writing chops
>"visa versa"
>http://tinyurl.com/qgpvlc5
>---------------------------------------------
>
>Biker gang member Wieber. Is there anything he HASN'T been?
>
>"I rode with a gang for a very short time. Until they got doped up
>and decided that the bank in the next town was open and available for
>a sudden and unexpected withdrawal. At which point..I removed my
>colors, got on my panhead and mosied on down the road."
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.survivalism/_yfNQCHqHjY/XvuInSwiScwJ
>--------------------------------------------------
>
>Leftist hackers will never infiltrate Wieber's computer
>
>"Ive had a number of computer attacks by actual people over the
>years..typically leftwingers (all unsucessful) so I keep my security a
>bit tighter than most folks do."
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.crafts.metalworking/9PulvgnPKAQ/M_zp4hkoug4J
>---------------------------------------------------
>
>Wieber's life is better than yours.
>
>"When was the last time you attended a Black Tie dinner function with
>the president of a Fortune 500 Company? Last year for me.
>When was the last time you sat down over pizza and discussed the
>economy with a world class economist? Last month, for me."
> http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/36cd1553d4b2efac
>
>"I own my own business doing engineering etc etc."
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
>
>"I can high kick a light bulb out of an 8 ft ceiling fixture"
>https://groups.google.com/forum/#!original/rec.crafts.metalworking/DB1Bm1vqU7Y/iGGv6zhvnZYJ
>---------------------------------------
>
>History Student Wieber
>
>"Gunner, who IS a student of military history and war"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/49650e55e6e593cf
>
>"eff..stick with Blackstone, ok? Its a bit late to be catching up with
>military history. Ive been a student of it for well over 30 yrs"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/e4f456d678fa05d2
>
>"Gunner, student of history"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/7312daff1e449364
>
>"Though I AM a student of history"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/84be46090d3146f7
>
>"Im also a student of not only military history, but geopolitical
>history"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.california/msg/4b34eff2cfdde518
>
><drum roll...>
>
>"Hitler was a Socialist/Fascist just like US liberals"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/fdfacb0e8c4998f4
>-------------------------------------
>
>Wieber NEVER stops working (lying).
>
>"In the past 40 yrs..I think Ive been unemployed for a total of
>hummm...6 days."
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/d9eb24039fa0acfd
>
>"Ive only been unemployed for about 3 months"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.bush/msg/5289d0323c4125cf
>
>All that working, paychecks not so much.
>
>"So I went dumpster diving. And I sat in a house with no gas or
>electricity and ate my dumpster food, and shared it with my dogs and
>cats. We all were happy to have food. For two weeks."
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/a2ddd7a2af9e6173
>----------------------------------------
>
>Do not cross Wieber, he has an army of lawyers ready to issue a
>"summins."
>
>"Im sure your provider is going to be real happy to get a phone call
>from me, my lawyer, and a couple other folks whom carry a bit of
>weight" (2007)
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/493fb369d84be771
>
>"My lawyer hates reading between the lines" (2010)
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/f1f0383a30932b60
>
>"Im a big fan of turning them over to the cops along with a signed
>statement (having my Lawyer draw it up and deliver it)" (2010)
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.survival/msg/fb3cf3b61873c5fc
>
>"My lawyer will be sending you a summins in the next few weeks or so"
>(2011)
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.california/msg/f5b8947d02c618fa
>-----------------------------------
>
>Marksman Wieber
>
>"Shooting a coyote in the head at 75 yrd with a handgun is dead
>easy."
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/da06ccf3a0e72385
>
>"In my circle..we dont bother to take out a rifle until the range to
>ground squirrels gets past 175-200 yrds."
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/e7612d549bdd6b65
>
>"I drag out the rifles when the ranges go over 250 meters when varmint
>shooting."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/cf75ae65479ede0f
>
>"...but Ive trained (and actually survived) multiple
>targets/assailents, armed with a variety of weapons, over the years.
>Ive been shot, stabbed, bayoneted, blown up, bucked off, run over,
>thiumped on, clubbed, smashed bashed and generally been abused...but
>while Im not as fast as I used to be...I can still punch a .45 round
>into multiple targets while keeping at least 2 pieces of brass in the
>air at the same time I shot in a combat match Sept 7th of this
>year..they put me in with the active military and active police
>shooters and I took 1st place. Got yet another dust collector to try
>to find a place for. 5 falling plates at 15 yrds in 2.01 seconds.
>Slow as molasses for a hot shooter..slow as hell for me in my
>prime...but still faster than 99.999 people on the street And that
>was not having competed in several years, cold off the street, with my
>daily gun and old ammo grabbed out of the junk self. I ran the course
>again with a .41 Magnum, full house loads..and my best time was 2.51
>seconds. Shrug...one doesnt think..one simply does..muscle memory
>does the rest. After shooting at least 1 million rounds out of
>handguns alone over the past 30 yrs...."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.survival/msg/814fb94f4af5ed84
>--------------------------------
>
>Wieber's even more amazing friends
>
>"A buddy of mine (Ranger) killed a deer once on a $100 bet, with a
>ball pein hammer."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/cf75ae65479ede0f
>-----------------------------------
>
>Wieber, Macho Mitty. Bears and boar, watch out!
>
>"From about 20 feet. Not a baited bear or dog run bear either. I snuck
>up her fair and square. But then..I was used to hunting far more
>dangerous game."
>
>"how about wild boar with a bowie knife? Been there, done that."
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/ebb54d1b4f0bedfd
>
>"the last two wild boar and the last 3 deer I harvested were with
>handguns. Oh..and second and third elk I took were with handguns."
>http://groups.google.com/group/talk.politics.misc/msg/2f45ca9a15826bc3
>
>"I took a boar with an obsidian tipped spear once. "
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.atheism/msg/9637d110cdd03169
>
>"I competed in several pistol competitions and came in 2nd and 3rd,
>which included reloading both revolvers and semiautos and killed,
>butchered and packed out a number of wild boar with one arm."
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.survival/msg/5aeb44a357a40201
>-------------------------------------
>
>Wieber is indestructible!
>
>Ive been treated for injuries as a result of rodeo, motorcycles,
>knives, explosive devices, assault. aircraft crashes and motor vehicle
>crashes.
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/acebd3f3a912ff2e
>--------------------------------------
>
>The stupendous Wieber tops world records!
>
>264 mph motorcycle
>http://groups.google.com/group/talk.politics.guns/msg/504734f74873c17f
>
>42 knot Hobie Cat
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/0042848ac1416cbe
>
>2 foot centipede
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/e32c62114ea73910
>
>Drives 10 million miles <913 miles every day for 30 years>
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/ce00195d4af80a15
>
>Only 1 million on "scooters" though.
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/7dc2a66a8a53c2d6
>-------------------------------------
>
>Self professed animal lover.
>
>Except for beating one dog.
>"What he seemed to have a handled on was smoking my cigarrettes, and
>guzzling energy drinks like a speed freak when he wasn't downing
>Mountain Dew or beating his dog"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/551e94166afc0da2
>
>And hanging another from a choker chain. A redneck classic.
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/5e8ae7330e8be437
>--------------------
>
>Wieber's funniest lies.
>
>"I never lie"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/0264cc658d2e57fb
>
>"I never lie"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.liberalism/msg/9ef5f530780d8194
>
>"I lied about who I was and how old I was"
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/b6421cb4f5a8eb52
>
><Readers, cage your irony meters>
>
>"I can say with a clear conscience that I dont lie. And I dont.
>Ive made a point of it for most of my life. Ever since I discovered
>its far far to difficult to remember which lies one tells which person
>and it comes back and bites you in the ass."
>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/msg/7f633fef7961cc92
>---------------------
>
>And in case you couldn't guess, here are some of his IQ stories.
>
>"mid 150s"
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/60beacdc8a0bd420
>
>"In 1971, I was given a battery of tests at Michigan Tech University
>(Houghton) and after some head scratching, the chief of testing
>declared I had an IQ of 157. They wrote several articles on the
>subject and published them somewhere."
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
>
>"165"
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.machines.cnc/msg/b8b3afb9ad1fd63f
>-----------------------
>
>Wieber was/wasn't a Mensa member.
>
>"Was asked to join Mensa, but didnt (proves Im smart) " 2001
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/60beacdc8a0bd420
>
>"Mensa? Been there, done that." 2009
>http://groups.google.com/group/misc.survivalism/msg/890c10adbedb9f8a
>
>"Certainly not the same Mensa that I belonged to." 2013
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.usa/msg/b5c3c389ba595b74
>----------------------------
>
>Wieber hates/loves the Wieber Cliff Notes.
>
>"A great set up for court!!"
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/talk.politics.guns/BfeVyikv-Jo/hvwmn6m4cDEJ
>
>("summins" must be enroute via turtle express)
>
>"a pretty good listing of my accomplishments"
>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.survivalism/T0BKEovPmIA/qM2K2lIlG-0J
>------------------------------
(VBG)
Good to see my fans are still fumbling around.
(VBG)
Gunner
--
"Their mommies tell them they're special, Liberals just don't understand
that "special" is a polite euphemism for;
*window licker on the short bus*"
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: $$$ MAKE CASH NOW $$$
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/4e582aeb8ba021b3?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 8:50 am
From: deedy261@gmail.com
10$ per refer Signup | 5$ per Referral Link Hit or Visit.
http://TimelyJob.com/?id=deedy29
==============================================================================
TOPIC: An open letter to President Obama
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/6a0df9f0b0758d3e?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Nov 3 2013 8:02 am
From: pyotr filipivich
Tom Gardner <Mars@Tacks> on Mon, 04 Nov 2013 03:54:44 -0500 typed in
misc.survivalism the following:
>On 11/2/2013 11:31 PM, pyotr filipivich wrote:
>> "RogerN" <regor@midwest.net> on Sat, 2 Nov 2013 16:17:11 -0500 typed
>> in misc.survivalism the following:
>>> "Kickin' Ass and Takin' Names" wrote:
>>>> Sounds as though Matt's been drinking the rightwingnutjob Kool-Aid and
>>>> feeding at the Fox trough.
>>>>
>>>> That, plus, he's jealous of Obama.
>>>
>>> Do you like Obama's Kool-Aid?
>>>
>>> Irony: some vote for Obama over jobs and healthcare, then find themselves
>>> working part time and losing their insurance. Is that the change they hoped
>>> for?
>>>
>>> They call you a libtard to not insult mentally retarded people.
>>
>> Kissing ass is just hoping that nobody else notices that he has
>> not a single rebuttal tot he argument, and can only attack the
>> messenger. He's just as pathetic, if not more so, that Obama.
>>
>He has a lot of gumption to post here daily when he is in such a
>position! What else CAN he do but attack the messenger? Give him
>credit where credit is due!
No can do. His credit rating is triple Z: 'Cash Only and examine
it very closely for forgeries'."
--
pyotr filipivich.
Just about the time you finally see light at the end of the tunnel,
you find out it's a Government Project to build more tunnel.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Science Quiz
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/e86758e53ea3692c?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 9:15 am
From: Gunner Asch
On Sun, 03 Nov 2013 20:34:33 -0800, pyotr filipivich
<phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:
>Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> on Sun, 03 Nov 2013 13:53:42 -0800
>typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
>>On Sun, 03 Nov 2013 06:58:04 -0600, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
>><lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>>BottleBob <bottlbob@earthlink.net> fired this volley in news:5c691859-
>>>5c65-422a-a7f5-d0b3c8972049@googlegroups.com:
>>>
>>>> IMO, Vanishingly few "Home Shops" have CNC equipment. We could
>>>> take a survey... :)
>>>
>>>I think it would have been safe to say that ten years ago. Today... I'm
>>>not so sure it wouldn't be better worded "A minority of 'Home Shops'...".
>>>
>>>Advertising, cheap low-end stepper-driven machines from China, and ARM
>>>processors have made the entire category of CNC more common and more
>>>affordable.
>>>
>>>Now... 'Home Shops' that have big CNC iron are fewer, to be sure! But
>>>even that's becoming more common as conversions become simpler and less
>>>expensive to do.
>>>
>>>Lloyd
>>
>>Not to mention as American machine shops slow and close...their older
>>less desirable (slower) machines are showing up in hobby shops all
>>across America. And for very very little money. Go to auctions..and
>>its not the pros and dealers who are buying CNC Bridgeports and
>>similar machines..its hobby guys.
>
> Friend/classmate bought a Cincinnati #1 vertical mill. Cost him
>more to ship it than to buy it, much less than two grand total. Got
>it set up and discovered that it had a swivel table (brain fart, can't
>recall the technical name for such a thing - the entire worktable
>pivoted) as an added bonus.
>
> He was happy.
>--
>pyotr filipivich
>"With Age comes Wisdom. Although more often, Age travels alone."
"universal table"
Gunner
--
"Their mommies tell them they're special, Liberals just don't understand
that "special" is a polite euphemism for;
*window licker on the short bus*"
---
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Navy SEALs ordered to remove 'don't tread on me' Navy Jack from
uniforms
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/4ed0d43cae18ef8a?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Nov 4 2013 10:36 am
From: "Ray Keller"
http://dailycaller.com/2013/11/01/navy-seals-ordered-to-remove-dont-tread-on-me-navy-jack-from-uniforms/
Navy SEALs ordered to remove 'don't tread on me' Navy Jack from uniforms
The Navy Jack is the 'don't tread on me' flag, one that has earned a revered
place in America's naval history and a beloved place in sailor's hearts,
through its use for over two centuries. This symbol of America's naval
ferocity has spanned our country's entire existence, flying from the masts of
the Continental Navy during the war of independence, to today's War on
Terror. In fact, an amendment to the Navy code called SECNAV Instruction
10520.6 clearly states that as of 31 May 2002 all ships are to fly the flag
throughout the duration of the War on Terror.
So why would ranking SEAL commanders ban the historical symbol? Is the
proverbial top bass banning the flag? Is President Obama?
Clearly the administration and sycophant "top brass" officers have degraded
America's military prestige; from hand-tying rules of engagement, to uniform
regulations that make our military allegedly more compatible with foreign
forces, to the banning of an awe-inspiring flag that traces its roots to the
first U.S. Navy. We have a civilian-led military, but why should our ranking
commanders be complicit in the administration's war on it? Why don't they
stand up to Obama and his leftist cronies?
During my two deployments to Iraq, "Don't Tread on Me" was a phrase seen on
nearly every uniform and platoon space — including mine. From patches to
flags to large paintings on concrete barriers, our commanders themselves wore
the insignia on their sleeves — until now.
Perhaps this is why so many of my former teammates felt compelled to send me
the email below. They may not be able to expose the administration's
travesty, but I can. The email, dated October 22, reads:
ALL:
WARCOM and GROUP TWO/ONE have pushed out the uniform policy for NWU III and
any patches worn on the sleeve.
All personnel are only authorized to wear the matching "AOR" American Flag
patch on the right shoulder. You are no longer authorized to wear the "Don't
Tread On Me" patch.
Again the only patch authorized for wear is the American flag on the right
shoulder. Please pass the word to all
Thanks
Senior Enlisted Advisor
[Name Redacted]
After reading the email, I first wondered, 'why?' (Actually, first I headed
to the gym to take out my frustration and anger on some unsuspecting weights
with the fury and intensity only a former Navy SEAL can exert.) Why would our
leaders sell out our heritage? Why would they rob present and future sailors
of our battle cry?
When a friend of mine asked his leadership the same question, he was told,
"The Jack is too closely associated with radical groups." We must assume that
this thought policeman embedded in the SEAL community is speaking of the Tea
Party, whose flag (which also dates from the American Revolution) depicts a
snake with the same defiant slogan as The Navy Jack.
This begs yet another question: Who defines "radical group"? The last time I
checked, all military personnel are under oath to "support and defend the
constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic." The Tea Party stands
for constitutional rights and founding principles of civil liberties and
limited government. Radical? Not unless you're a leftist hell-bent on
destroying the foundations of our country. Or as the President has stated as
the objective of his presidency, "to fundamentally transform" America.
My friends asked me what they should do about this order. I answer them by
saying, "You took an oath to defend this country from enemies foreign and
domestic. Will you put your career before country? Will you put your career
before your sacred oath?" I cannot tell anyone how to respond. I can tell you
though that an enemy — foreign or domestic — that tries to take the Navy Jack
from my uniform could only do so by ripping the patriotic patch from the
uniform of my cold, dead body.
We all have choices to make. The Obama administration and the yes-men top
brass have decided to wage war on our Navy's heritage. Will the SEALs choose
to defend that heritage and defy them, with all the impertinence the flag's
slogan implies? Or will they be tread upon?
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