twitter: rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 17 topics

rec.crafts.metalworking
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking?hl=en

rec.crafts.metalworking@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Giving it to them straight (guns are metal, right?)
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/129b1e3c398586ff?hl=en
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== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Feb 14 2010 11:51 pm
From: Don Foreman

On Sun, 14 Feb 2010 21:55:08 -0800, "Bill Noble"
<nobody@nowhere.invalid> wrote:

>let's give everyone a thermonuclear device and the ability to detonate it.
>
>that is the logical conclusion of your line of reasoning. it is after all,
>not for killing people, it is for conflict, and nothing speaks conflict like
>a few megatons of explosive power and a few terajoules of released energy.
>
>would you like to rethink your position or will you support the above
>statement?

He didn't think this position. It's a cite or quote of a position
someone else thought. Some plausible points are made but they'd best
be defended by the original author rather than the messenger.

Giving everyone a nuke is your conception, invention and perhaps
attempt at sarcasm, obviously frivolous and far from a logical
conclusion. No mention was made anywhere of government or private
entity giving anyone anything. Your nukes note is sensational but it
has nothing at all to do with the matter of responsible citizens'
right to have and hold firearms for self defense.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 4:46 am
From: "Stormin Mormon"

That was answered, in the article I posted. I
guess you didn't read it?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Bill Noble" <nobody@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
message
news:hlanju$l7f$1@news.eternal-september.org...
let's give everyone a thermonuclear device and the
ability to detonate it.

that is the logical conclusion of your line of
reasoning. it is after all,
not for killing people, it is for conflict, and
nothing speaks conflict like
a few megatons of explosive power and a few
terajoules of released energy.

would you like to rethink your position or will
you support the above
statement?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: deisel shut off soleneoid
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/fd9eb5c12c70ae0a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 12:25 am
From: Bruce L. Bergman

On Sun, 14 Feb 2010 13:21:00 -0500, RLM <rlm@127.0.0.1> wrote:

>The three wire solenoids that are used on aerial equipment throttles has
>one negative two positives. The two positive wires pull the solenoid in
>then one positive is dropped to allow a lower amperage to hold the
>solenoid in when the plunger bottoms out. The voltage is still on all
>three wires but amps only flow through the holding winding. The solenoid
>itself disconnects one coil inside when it bottoms out.
>
>You have a strong pull to bottom out then it takes less power to hold.
>Solenoid doesn't over heat this way.
>
>Of course the engine returns to idle when you release the foot switch and
>voltage is dropped from the throttle solenoid.
>
>These are what I'm familiar with.

The terms I'm familiar with are "Pick and Hold" - the "Pick" coil
pulls up the solenoid from full open, the "Hold" coil keeps it up and
requires much less current.

The "Pick" coil is usually rated intermittent duty, and will smoke
itself if left on too long. You usually put a set of switch contacts
in the solenoid to open the Pick coil when it's fully in, even if you
leave power on the lead.

--<< Bruce >>--

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT, Getting cash fast?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/e7794248f9ff9545?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 12:39 am
From: Bruce L. Bergman

On Sun, 14 Feb 2010 12:25:21 -0600, "RogerN" <regor@midwest.net>
wrote:

>
>My wife had an auto accident Friday and now needs something to drive to
>work. In short, I should get my income tax money this Friday, I'm wanting
>to get cash now and pay it off this Friday, it will save me $2000 over being
>forced to buy from a dealer for the auto we are wanting. I've found several
>auto's I like at dealers for the $7K-$8K range, I found some I like better
>from individuals for the $5K range (same model, newer, lower miles, $2k
>less). But either way I go about it, having the cash gives me leverage at
>the dealer or the option to buy from a private seller.
>
>Are their credit card cash advances that actually give you cash? Or how
>about pre-approved financing? Will financing companies approve you for a set
>amount based on book value?
>
>RogerN

Go rent an older car by the week for the wife to drive at
"Rent-A-Wreck", and get the auto insurer to pick up the tab if you
can. A weekly-rate car will cost you a WHOLE LOT LESS than playing
games with cash advances and 'Rapid Refund' from a tax preparer.

And any car deal that you negotiate in a rush because you have to
get the car Right Now is going to burn you too, The car dealers can
see you coming a quarter mile away, and they have lots of ways to bury
extra profits in the deal.

ANY deal that you do in a rush is going to burn you, usually badly.
You have given up your right to walk away from a bad deal, and they
know it.

My Dad thought he could do the same thing and sign for high interest
rate Dealer Financing to pick up the motorhome Now so he could use it
for work that much sooner, then turn around and get a regular car loan
from the bank to pay it off that would take about a week - the Dealer
said it would cost him about $250 to unwind it "If he could find a
better deal."

The Dealer LIED. Getting that New Motorhome Smell a week early cost
him $3,000+ to terminate the first loan early.

I'm pretty sure he would have lost far less by simply not working
for that week, the commissions could not have been that much.

--<< Bruce >>--

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 6:17 am
From: alan200@iinet.net.oz

On Sun, 14 Feb 2010 12:25:21 -0600, "RogerN" <regor@midwest.net>
wrote:

Send her to work in a taxi for a couple of days, would cost much
less than $2k and will give you time to find the right car.

alan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: This will Blow your mind!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/83adedff3d543d22?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 12:54 am
From: Winston

On 2/14/2010 11:07 PM, Don Foreman wrote:
> On Sun, 14 Feb 2010 22:22:41 -0800, Winston<Winston@bigbrother.net>
> wrote:

(...)

>> Good! That means you grok Ohms Law which states we cannot expect
>> large voltage differences on the ends of a good conductor
>> that is passing Very Little Current.
>
> You demonstrated quite the contrary with your experiment.

No, in my first experiment, I was not able to determine any voltage
difference across the wire connecting the top of R1 to the top of R2.

When I saw the maximum voltage in my 2nd experiment, it was being
dropped across a ~22.8 K ohm resistor. Current was on the order
of 5.3 uA, so I did not expect to see measurable voltage drop
across ~1.5" of an 0.022" diameter wire (tens of nano Henrys?).

X(L) for say 50 nH at 60 Hz is what, 19 micro ohms?
I'd need a meter that could resolve femtovolts while nulling
out millivolts. I sure wasn't going to see the 1.0 V difference
predicted by the Prof. :)

That wasn't the proper place to look anyway, as the prof had indicated
that the two voltages in question were dropped across R1 and R2.
If you isolate the top of R1 from the top of R2 you will see that
they *do* have different voltage drops and they *are* 180 degrees
phase displaced. His circuit shorts the 'meters' together which
completely obliterates the appearance of these differences, however.

> Induction can produce a voltage difference from end to end of a
> good or perfect conductor regardless of what current it may be
> passing.

Yes, and in my experiment, that voltage difference across the
entire winding was about 120 mV, open circuit.

> Ohmic IR drop is independent of induction and superposition holds.

Yes! With R1 and R2 connected together as in the Prof's 2nd
circuit, the voltage across R1 was summed with the voltage
across R2 to yield a single voltage value. When R1 equals R2,
the voltage dropped across them both sums to a value that is
very nearly zero because of phase cancellation. In my second
experiment, I showed that 5.3 uA through a 11.35K ohm resistor
can appear to have a voltage drop of very nearly zero (a
great deal less than 60 mV) if it is connected with another
11.35K ohm resistor that is also passing 5.3 uA from the same
source, but in the opposite direction.

That is what I have been on about.

--Winston

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT: Guns Take Lives -- Again!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/55aad5dba11805d9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 1:33 am
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

krw wrote:
>
> On Sat, 13 Feb 2010 19:12:03 -0800 (PST), Too_Many_Tools
> <too_many_tools@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >On Feb 13, 5:55 pm, Jim Chandler <n4...@gte.net> wrote:
> >> On Fri, 12 Feb 2010 20:47:28 -0800 (PST), Too_Many_Tools
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >On Feb 12, 3:25 pm, Rich Grise on Google groups
> >> ><richardgr...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >> From: "Dudley Brown" <Dudley.Br...@nationalgunrights.org>
> >>
> >> >> I thought you would enjoy this story out of Atlanta, Georgia. If you
> >> >> do, please forward it to your friends.
> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> College student shoots home invader, saves 10 lives
> >>
> >> >> Yet another reason to keep a gun in the house . . .
> >>
> >> >> Several months ago, in the notoriously dangerous neighborhood of
> >> >> College Park in Atlanta, Georgia, two armed criminals broke into a
> >> >> house party of students.
> >>
> >> >> After confiscating the group's valuables, the invaders split the men
> >> >> and women up into different rooms.
> >>
> >> >> Witnesses say the perpetrators then counted their rounds and discussed
> >> >> if they had "enough" ammunition.
> >>
> >> >> The students believe the gunmen were going to rape and murder the
> >> >> entire group of students, who were celebrating a birthday at the end
> >> >> of the semester.
> >>
> >> >> However, one male student, whose identity is being protected by police
> >> >> and local media, retrieved a handgun from his backpack and fired at
> >> >> the thug who was detaining the men.
> >>
> >> >> (That is: One smart student had prepared for a night in College Park,
> >> >> Atlanta.)
> >>
> >> >> The criminal fled the apartment under the threat of injury and never
> >> >> returned.
> >>
> >> >> The student, continuing on into the girls' room, found the other thug,
> >> >> 23-year-old Calvin Lavant, preparing to rape his first victim.
> >>
> >> >> The student exchanged gunfire with Lavant, lethally wounding him in
> >> >> the process. Lavant fled through a window and died in front of his
> >> >> apartment, only one building away.
> >>
> >> >> One of the female students was injured during the exchange, but
> >> >> doctors expect a full and complete recovery.
> >>
> >> >> So what's the point
> >>
> >> >> A student saved the girls from rape, and saved the whole group of 10
> >> >> people (including himself) from murder . . . and he did it with a
> >> >> handgun.
> >>
> >> >> This is a perfect example of how ludicrous "big city gun laws" are.
> >> >> What if this had happened in New York, Chicago, or any of the other
> >> >> big cities that criminalize their citizens' self defense?
> >>
> >> >> Yes, we would be reading an entirely different story -- one so
> >> >> horrendous that we would shudder at the very words.
> >>
> >> >> Either this whole group of friends would have been raped and murdered
> >> >> by these two sorry excuses for human beings . . . or the hero of this
> >> >> story would be facing prison time for firearm possession and murder.
> >>
> >> >> Thankfully, however, Atlanta hasn't outlawed self-defense yet. And
> >> >> since someone had a gun and was willing to use it, innocent life was
> >> >> preserved.
> >>
> >> >> Congratulations to the unnamed hero of this story. You saved your
> >> >> friends' lives.
> >>
> >> >> In Liberty,
> >> >> Dudley Brown
> >> >> Executive Director
> >> >> National Association for Gun Rights
> >>
> >> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> >> To help the National Association for Gun Rights grow, please forward
> >> >> this to a friend.
> >>
> >> >> To view this email as a web page, please click this link: view online.
> >>
> >> >> Help fight gun control. Donate to the National Association for Gun
> >> >> Rights!
> >>
> >> >Why don't you tell the truth lying NRA winger?
> >>
> >> >There are too many guns in too many hands of people who should not
> >> >have them.
> >>
> >> >Psych testing for gun ownership is coming.
> >>
> >> >TMT
> >>
> >> >Prof. in custody in fatal shooting on Ala. campus
> >> >By KRISTIN M. HALL, Associated Press Writer Kristin M. Hall,
> >> >Associated Press Writer
> >> >2 mins ago
> >>
> >> >HUNTSVILLE, Ala. – Authorities say a woman opened fire during a
> >> >faculty meeting at the University of Alabama's Huntsville campus,
> >> >killing three biology professors and injuring three other school
> >> >employees.
> >>
> >> >University spokesman Ray Garner said the shooter was caught outside
> >> >the building without incident, and no students were harmed in the
> >> >shooting Friday.
> >>
> >> >Several students identified the woman who was being taken into custody
> >> >as Amy Bishop, an instructor and researcher at the university. She was
> >> >taken Friday night in handcuffs from a police precinct to the county
> >> >jail and could be heard saying, "It didn't happen. There's no way ....
> >> >they are still alive."
> >>
> >> >Local media also named the biology professor as the suspected shooter,
> >> >though Garner said he could not identify her.
> >>
> >> >Police said no charges had been filed and they were interviewing the
> >> >woman suspect and a man identified as "a person of interest."
> >>
> >> >Garner said the three killed were Gopi K. Podila, the chairman of the
> >> >Department of Biological Sciences, and two other faculty members,
> >> >Maria Ragland Davis and Adriel Johnson.
> >>
> >> >Two others are in critical condition, and a third who was wounded was
> >> >upgraded to fair condition. The injured were identified as department
> >> >members Luis Cruz-Vera and Joseph Leahy and staffer Stephanie
> >> >Monticello. Their specific conditions were not released.
> >>
> >> >Sammie Lee Davis said his wife, Maria Ragland Davis, was a researcher
> >> >who had tenure at the university.
> >>
> >> >In a brief phone interview, he said he was told his wife was at a
> >> >meeting to discuss the tenure status of another faculty member who got
> >> >angry and started shooting.
> >>
> >> >He said his wife had mentioned the shooter before, describing the
> >> >woman as "not being able to deal with reality" and "not as good as she
> >> >thought she was."
> >>
> >> >Nick Lawton, the son of a biology professor at the school, said his
> >> >father was not among the victims, but he did not know much more.
> >>
> >> >Lawton, 25, was exercising when a friend phoned him to tell him about
> >> >the shooting. He called his father, Robert Lawton, and found out that
> >> >he was not hurt, then he let rest of his family know.
> >>
> >> >"All I know is that my father is OK," Nick Lawton told The Associated
> >> >Press.
> >>
> >> >Sophomore Erin Johnson told The Huntsville Times a biology faculty
> >> >meeting was under way when she heard screams coming from a conference
> >> >room.
> >>
> >> >University police secured the building and students were cleared from
> >> >it. There was still a heavy police presence on campus Friday night,
> >> >with police tape cordoning off the main entrance to the university.
> >>
> >> >The Huntsville campus has about 7,500 students in northern Alabama,
> >> >not far from the Tennessee line. The university is known for its
> >> >scientific and engineering programs and often works closely with NASA.
> >>
> >> >The space agency has a research center on the school's campus, where
> >> >many scientists and engineers from NASA's Marshall Space Flight Center
> >> >perform Earth and space science research and development.
> >>
> >> >The university posted a message on its Web site Friday afternoon
> >> >telling students the campus was closed Friday night and all students
> >> >were encouraged to go home. Counselors were available to speak with
> >> >students.
> >>
> >> >It's the second shooting in a week on an area campus. Last Friday, a
> >> >14-year-old student was killed in a middle school hallway in nearby
> >> >Madison, allegedly by a fellow student.
> >>
> >> >"This town is unaccustomed to shootings and multiple deaths," Garner
> >> >said.
> >>
> >> >___
> >>
> >> >Associated Press Writers Phillip Rawls and Desiree Hunter in
> >> >Montgomery, Ala., and Jacob Jordan and Daniel Yee in Atlanta
> >> >contributed to this report.
> >>
> >> You are a typical liberal idiot, TMT. Your name should be changed to
> >> "I dropped too many tools on my head". Psych testing is only good for
> >> the moment it is done. It will not tell you ANYTHING about the future
> >> actions of the one tested. Only a moronic liberal (that's you) would
> >> believe that testing will do any good.
> >>
> >> Jim- Hide quoted text -
> >>
> >> - Show quoted text -
> >
> >Psych testing would tell us that you should not own guns.
>
> You're just too stupid for words, TooStupid.
>
> >Good enough for me and the rest of America.
>
> You speak for "the rest of America"? I don't think so, TooStupid.

South America, maybe?

--
Greed is the root of all eBay.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:54 am
From: John Husvar

In article <rLOdnc1zsLs1UeXWnZ2dnUVZ_hKdnZ2d@posted.toastnet>,
Beryl <fourl@road.net> wrote:

> Jim Chandler wrote:
>
>
> > Psych testing is only good for the moment it is done. It will not
> > tell you ANYTHING about the future actions of the one tested.
>
> Psych testing for gun ownership could have made all the difference to
> three dead biology professors. The moment when Amy Bishop shot her
> brother came back, 24 years in the future, to the University of
> Alabama's Huntsville campus.
>
> And now I see more stories about her.
> Amy Bishop at time of 1993 mail bomb investigation
> Accused shooter linked to Harvard bomb plot
> Alleged University Shooter Was Suspect in Harvard Professor Bomb Attempt

"Linked to," "suspect," etc. etc. might have suggested she was a
dangerous person. Or it might merely suggest she had acquaintance with
some less than savory people. Her brother's death was treated as an
accident.

Accidents happen and/or murders get treated as accidents sometimes.

Now exactly what psychological test would have predicted she might shoot
colleagues in what was apparently a tenure dispute?

Someone may have dropped the proverbial ball with regard to her violent
proclivities, but it's far too late now for any second guessing.

Oh, and the gun in neither case, the professor or the partygoer, did one
damned thing: People did something _using_ a gun, a gun neither you, I
nor any other entity could have prevented them having if either was
determined to have one.

Sorry, freedom is dangerous and expensive. Life is like that, guns or
none.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Statistics for week ending 20100215
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/906a174b721b98ae?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 1:39 am
From: news@wess.mdns.org (Statistics)

This post is generated weekly as a service to the participants of
Rec.Crafts.Metalworking

============================================================================
Analysis of posts to Rec.Crafts.Metalworking
============================================================================
(stats compiled with a script by Garry Knight)

Total posts considered: 2,112 over 7 days
Earliest article: Mon Feb 8 22:53:07 2010
Latest article: Sun Feb 14 23:53:14 2010
Original articles: 98, replies: 2,014
Total size of posts: 6,866,911 bytes (6,705K) (6.55M)
Average 301 articles per day, 0.94 MB per day, 3,251 bytes per article
Total headers: 3,203 KB bodies: 3,502 KB
Body text - quoted: 2,193 KB, original: 1,130 KB = 34.01%, sigs: 168 KB
Total number of posters: 288, average 23,843 bytes per poster
Total number of threads: 193, average 35,579 bytes per thread
Total number of User-Agents: 43

============================================================================
Top 20 posters by number of articles
============================================================================
1: Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>............... : 133
2: Lookout <mrLookout@yahoo.com>.................................. : 97
3: Too_Many_Tools <too_many_tools@yahoo.com>...................... : 91
4: "Burled Frau" <achtung@jawol.jah>.............................. : 69
5: Hawke <davesmithers@digitalpath.net>........................... : 58
6: "Ed Huntress" <huntres23@optonline.net>........................ : 54
7: "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul>...................... : 51
8: Wes <clutch@lycos.com>......................................... : 48
9: cavelamb <cavelamb@earthlink.net>.............................. : 41
10: Don Foreman <dforeman@NOSPAMgoldengate.net>.................... : 38
11: Curly Surmudgeon <CurlySurmudgeon@live.com>.................... : 34
12: F. George McDuffee <gmcduffee@mcduffee-associates.us>.......... : 34
13: tankfixer <paul.carrier@gmail.com>............................. : 33
14: "dcaster@krl.org" <dcaster@krl.org>............................ : 31
15: Beam Me Up Scotty <Then-Destroy-Everything@Talk-n-dog.com>..... : 29
16: "Buerste" <buerste@wowway.com>................................. : 29
17: Larry Jaques <novalidaddress@di\/ersify.com>................... : 25
18: "RD (The Sandman)" <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net>........... : 25
19: grey_ghost471-newsgroups@yahoo.com (Gray Ghost)................ : 24
20: "Existential Angst" <UNfitcat@UNoptonline.net>................. : 24

============================================================================
Top 20 posters by article size in Kbytes
============================================================================
1: Lookout <mrLookout@yahoo.com>.................................. : 404
2: Too_Many_Tools <too_many_tools@yahoo.com>...................... : 351
3: Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>............... : 322
4: "Burled Frau" <achtung@jawol.jah>.............................. : 249
5: "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul>...................... : 239
6: "Ed Huntress" <huntres23@optonline.net>........................ : 233
7: Hawke <davesmithers@digitalpath.net>........................... : 188
8: tankfixer <paul.carrier@gmail.com>............................. : 181
9: Curly Surmudgeon <CurlySurmudgeon@live.com>.................... : 159
10: F. George McDuffee <gmcduffee@mcduffee-associates.us>.......... : 125
11: cavelamb <cavelamb@earthlink.net>.............................. : 115
12: Beam Me Up Scotty <Then-Destroy-Everything@Talk-n-dog.com>..... : 104
13: Wes <clutch@lycos.com>......................................... : 104
14: "RD (The Sandman)" <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net>........... : 102
15: Don Foreman <dforeman@NOSPAMgoldengate.net>.................... : 102
16: grey_ghost471-newsgroups@yahoo.com (Gray Ghost)................ : 100
17: Giovanni Givens <givensdafrgiovannitsd@gmail.com>.............. : 90
18: "dcaster@krl.org" <dcaster@krl.org>............................ : 85
19: Larry Jaques <novalidaddress@di\/ersify.com>................... : 79
20: "lab~rat >:-)" <chase@cheeze.net>............................. : 74

============================================================================
Top 20 responders by original text (> 5 posts)
============================================================================
1: "Robert Swinney" <judybob@tx.rr.com>........................... : 87.23%
2: "Artemus" <bogus@invalid.org>.................................. : 81.10%
3: Richard J Kinch <kinch@truetex.com>............................ : 77.65%
4: Patriot Games <Patriot@america.com>............................ : 72.95%
5: Bob Engelhardt <bobengelhardt@comcast.net>..................... : 72.84%
6: "William Wixon" <wwixon@frontiernet.net>....................... : 72.69%
7: F. George McDuffee <gmcduffee@mcduffee-associates.us>.......... : 71.76%
8: Steve Ackman <steve@SNIP-THIS.twoloonscoffee.com>.............. : 69.06%
9: E Z Peaces <cash@invalid.invalid>.............................. : 67.94%
10: Bob AZ <rwatson767@aol.com>................................... : 65.51%
11: Louis Ohland <ohland@charter.net>.............................. : 64.94%
12: Winston <Winston@bigbrother.net>............................... : 64.71%
13: Joe788 <larryrozer@yahoo.com>.................................. : 63.97%
14: Jim Wilkins <kb1dal@gmail.com>................................. : 63.59%
15: "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" <lloydspinsidemindspring.com>........... : 62.24%
16: pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com>........................ : 61.90%
17: "dcaster@krl.org" <dcaster@krl.org>............................ : 60.91%
18: cncmillgil <milgil@cin.net>.................................... : 55.51%
19: "Steve Lusardi" <stevenospam@lusardi.de>....................... : 53.61%
20: stans4@prolynx.com............................................. : 52.37%

============================================================================
Bottom 20 responders by original text (> 5 posts)
============================================================================
1: tankfixer <paul.carrier@gmail.com>............................. : 6.51%
2: Lookout <mrLookout@yahoo.com>.................................. : 7.83%
3: krw <krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzz>.................................... : 8.02%
4: "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell@earthlink.net>.............. : 8.53%
5: No-bammer <no-bammer@fgi.net>.................................. : 9.74%
6: Harold Burton <hal.i.burton@hotmail.com>....................... : 9.96%
7: grey_ghost471-newsgroups@yahoo.com (Gray Ghost)................ : 10.74%
8: Beam Me Up Scotty <Then-Destroy-Everything@Talk-n-dog.com>..... : 10.74%
9: Humperdink <hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com>.................... : 11.93%
10: RBnDFW <burkheimer@gmail.com>.................................. : 12.72%
11: Curly Surmudgeon <CurlySurmudgeon@live.com>.................... : 13.66%
12: "Snag" <snag_one@comcast.net>.................................. : 14.52%
13: HHnC <hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com>.......................... : 14.68%
14: "RD (The Sandman)" <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net>........... : 17.59%
15: "lab~rat >:-)" <chase@cheeze.net>............................. : 17.75%
16: Joe788 <joemama788@aol.com>.................................... : 17.97%
17: cavelamb <cavelamb@earthlink.net>.............................. : 18.77%
18: rangerssuck <rangerssuck@gmail.com>............................ : 19.33%
19: "Pete C." <aux3.DOH.4@snet.net>................................ : 22.18%
20: "David R.Birch" <dbirch@wi.rr.com>............................. : 24.56%

============================================================================
Top 20 threads by no. of articles
============================================================================
1: Cheater's Notes................................................ : 346
2: O.T. Toyota accelerator pics and explanations.................. : 71
3: Hey Ed, that snow coming up your way?.......................... : 57
4: OT-Social Security $28 billion in the hole..................... : 54
5: Home of the Free, the Brave and the Gay........................ : 48
6: A new "constitutional right"................................... : 47
7: This will Blow your mind!...................................... : 42
8: Funny snow blower problem...................................... : 40
9: Palin?s Unfavorability Ratings At All-Time High................ : 40
10: OT: Guns Save Lives -- Again!.................................. : 39
11: OT - Most states remain blue ...and sane....................... : 38
12: Miss me yet?................................................... : 35
13: What is it? Set 323............................................ : 35
14: OT Blue Cross.................................................. : 32
15: Obama Fiddles while our County Shivers......................... : 32
16: Low speeds - any disadvantages?................................ : 31
17: Cry, Gunner, it is OK to cry now............................... : 30
18: Forming wire mesh cloth - how to compress a cylindrical shape?. : 30
19: Socket on a stick.............................................. : 28
20: Lathe chuck spindle attachment................................. : 28

============================================================================
Top 20 threads by size in KB
============================================================================
1: Cheater's Notes................................................ : 1200
2: Home of the Free, the Brave and the Gay........................ : 292
3: OT-Social Security $28 billion in the hole..................... : 221
4: O.T. Toyota accelerator pics and explanations.................. : 206
5: Hey Ed, that snow coming up your way?.......................... : 172
6: A new "constitutional right"................................... : 166
7: OT - Most states remain blue ...and sane....................... : 163
8: Palin?s Unfavorability Ratings At All-Time High................ : 155
9: OT: Guns Save Lives -- Again!.................................. : 123
10: Funny snow blower problem...................................... : 116
11: Drop in December new-home sales fuels concern over recent gains : 113
12: This will Blow your mind!...................................... : 109
13: Lathe chuck spindle attachment................................. : 105
14: Statistics for week ending 20100208............................ : 103
15: Trijicon....................................................... : 102
16: Obama Fiddles while our County Shivers......................... : 98
17: OT Blue Cross.................................................. : 94
18: ---- HOT AMATEUR VIDEO ---- click here......................... : 90
19: Low speeds - any disadvantages?................................ : 86
20: Miss me yet?................................................... : 82

============================================================================
Top 10 cross-posted groups
============================================================================
1: alt.politics................................................... : 704
2: misc.survivalism............................................... : 678
3: talk.politics.guns............................................. : 673
4: alt.rush-limbaugh.............................................. : 573
5: alt.politics.libertarian....................................... : 465
6: alt.machines.cnc............................................... : 452
7: alt.fan.rush-limbaugh.......................................... : 337
8: alt.aol.tricks................................................. : 302
9: alt.usenet.kooks............................................... : 223
10: rec.puzzles.................................................... : 90

============================================================================
Top 10 User Agents by poster
============================================================================
1: G2/1.0......................................................... : 64
2: Forte Agent.................................................... : 46
3: Microsoft Outlook Express...................................... : 46
4: Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 (Windows/20090812)........................ : 27
5: Mozilla........................................................ : 19
6: Xnews.......................................................... : 13
7: rn............................................................. : 12
8: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 14.0.8089.726...................... : 7
9: Pan............................................................ : 7
10: MT-NewsWatcher................................................. : 7

============================================================================
Top 10 User Agents by number of posts
============================================================================
1: Forte Agent............................................... : 450 (21%)
2: Outlook Express........................................... : 330 (16%)
3: G2........................................................ : 297 (14%)
4: Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 (Windows............................. : 182 ( 9%)
5: Forte Free Agent.......................................... : 169 ( 8%)
6: Mozilla................................................... : 141 ( 7%)
7: Xnews..................................................... : 101 ( 5%)
8: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 12.0.1606..................... : 84 ( 4%)
9: slrn...................................................... : 84 ( 4%)
10: MT-NewsWatcher............................................ : 50 ( 2%)

============================================================================
Top 10 time zones
============================================================================
1: -0600.......................................................... : 612
2: -0500.......................................................... : 587
3: -0800.......................................................... : 349
4: -0800 (PST).................................................... : 297
5: UTC............................................................ : 141
6: -0700.......................................................... : 95
7: +0800.......................................................... : 12
8: +0100.......................................................... : 9
9: +0545.......................................................... : 5
10: +1100.......................................................... : 2

============================================================================
Turquoise SuperStat 2.2 * Message area statistics
=================================================

This report covers 7266 messages written between 2010-01-15 00:03:39 and
2010-02-14 23:42:08

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Blacklist of quoters (of people who have written at least three messages)

Place Name Msgs Ratio
1. T.Alan Kraus <soundadv@sonic.net> 3 95.42%
2. krw <krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzz> 8 92.06%
3. Lookout <mrLookout@yahoo.com> 134 91.46%
4. VFW <georgeswk@toast.net> 3 91.41%
5. Up North <BR549@canospam.com> 6 90.77%
6. tankfixer <paul.carrier@gmail.com> 94 90.76%
7. No-bammer <no-bammer@fgi.net> 19 90.49%
8. Jim Chandler <n427c@gte.net> 4 88.73%
9. Humperdink <hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com> 5 88.47%
10. Harold Burton <hal.i.burton@hotmail.com> 37 88.22%
11. Poetic Justice <Poetic-Justice@Talk-n-Dog.com> 3 88.12%
12. raamman <raamman@gmail.com> 3 87.83%
13. HHnC <hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com> 15 86.71%
14. Bill McKee <bmckeespamnot@ix.netcom.com> 21 86.37%
15. Strabo <strabo@flashlight.net> 4 85.92%

A total of 11573804 bytes were written (message bodies only), of which
6874212, or 59.39%, were quotes.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Toplist of writers

Place Name Msgs Bytes Quoted
1. Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> 377 463230 64.3%
2. Gunner Asch <gunner@lightspeed.net> 351 659172 62.0%
3. Wes <clutch@lycos.com> 269 218791 47.4%
4. Ed Huntress <huntres23@optonline.net> 238 594213 67.0%
5. Too_Many_Tools <too_many_tools@yahoo.com> 231 519649 72.9%
6. Burled Frau <achtung@jawol.jah> 204 331380 65.0%
7. Hawke <davesmithers@digitalpath.net> 161 364028 56.7%
8. John R. Carroll <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> 159 350100 57.9%
9. Michael A. Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> 139 178595 78.5%
10. Lookout <mrLookout@yahoo.com> 134 296400 91.5%
11. Buerste <buerste@wowway.com> 129 166532 64.4%
12. Jim Wilkins <kb1dal@gmail.com> 103 83474 42.2%
Joe788 <larryrozer@yahoo.com> 103 65186 45.5%
14. Steve B <deserttraver@fishmail.net> 102 110186 63.0%
15. dcaster@krl.org 96 92670 43.2%

A total of 531 people were identified.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Toplist of original content per message (of people who have written at
least three messages)

Place Name Orig. / Msgs = PrMsg Quoted
1. Statistics <news@wess.mdns.org> 88155 / 4 = 22038
2. Peter Principle <petesfeats@SNIPITgmail.com 29492 / 5 = 5898 8.8%
3. Frnak McKenney <frnak@far.from.the.madding. 60046 / 27 = 2223 52.2%
4. sittingduck <duck@spamherelots.com> 28640 / 14 = 2045 7.3%
5. Fred B. Brown <fredbbrown@nowhere.com> 20181 / 10 = 2018 27.0%
6. Priyanka Mehta <priyankaprasadmehta@gmail.c 9729 / 5 = 1945
7. Rich Grise on Google groups <richardgrise@y 6624 / 4 = 1656 18.3%
8. danmitch <danmitch@umflint.edu> 6304 / 4 = 1576 45.0%
9. F. George McDuffee <gmcduffee@mcduffee-asso138866 / 90 = 1542 27.2%
10. Bruce L. Bergman <bruceNOSPAMbergman@gmail. 34482 / 24 = 1436 39.4%
11. zhineng chen <zhineng111@gmail.com> 10009 / 7 = 1429
12. Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> 5626 / 4 = 1406 19.9%
13. Day Brown <dayhbrown@gmail.com> 4208 / 3 = 1402 35.2%
14. jbslocum@gmail.com 5338 / 4 = 1334 71.5%
15. Carla Fong <carla.xspamx.fong@verizon.net> 5310 / 4 = 1327 11.5%

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Toplist of subjects

Place Subject Msgs Bytes
1. Cheater's Notes 346 591678
2. USDA Climate Zone Changes 1990 to 2006 227 575904
A new "constitutional right" 227 438802
4. Cleaning up the shop 172 255680
5. Home of the Free, the Brave and the Gay 143 394841
6. The Future of US Kids Making Stuff... 132 358803
7. Trijicon 113 248932
8. OT-Social Security $28 billion in the hole 101 226368
9. Hey Ed, that snow coming up your way? 84 139222
10. O.T. Toyota accelerator pics and explanations 82 116859
11. Michelle pimping the airwaves 81 118220
12. New employee test for "metalworking skills" 80 99149
13. OT - Most states remain blue ...and sane. 68 170805
14. A test for young people 67 72039
15. What is it? Set 321 58 27001

A total of 735 subjects were identified.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Toplist of programs

Place Program Msgs
1. Microsoft Outlook Express 1268
2. Forte Agent 1229
3. G2 1167
4. Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 546
5. Forte Free Agent 479
6. Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English 398
7. slrn 369
8. Microsoft Windows Live Mail 337
9. Mozilla 287
10. Xnews 274
11. Microsoft Windows Mail 131
12. MT-NewsWatcher 123
13. Pan 115
14. MicroPlanet-Gravity 112
15. Thunderbird 2.0.0.12 57

A total of 43 different programs (not counting different versions) were
identified.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

==============================================================================
TOPIC: It's a wonderful life, in Obooverville
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/4ec7d32159a34577?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 2:07 am
From: "Buerste"

<hal> wrote in message news:4b78a322.10820421@news.newsguy.com...
> On Sun, 14 Feb 2010 18:58:06 -0600, "Burled Frau" <achtung@jawol.jah>
> wrote:
>
>>Ted:
>>Wh-where's my car?
>>
>>Stranger:
>>I beg your pardon?
>>
>>Ted:
>>My car, my car. I'm the fellow that owns the car that ran into your
>>bridge.
>>
>>Stranger:
>>What bridge?
>>
>>Ted:
>>What do you mean, what bridge? This bridge. Here. I ran into it. Cut a big
>>gash in the side of it there.
>>
>>Stranger:
>>You must mean some other bridge. You had me worried. One of the oldest
>>bridges in Obooverville.
>>
>>Ted:
>>Obooverville? Why, you mean Chappaquiddick.
>>
>>Stranger:
>>I mean Obooverville! Don't you think I know where I live? What's the
>>matter
>>with you?
>>
>>FADE TO BLACK
>>
> You need psychiatric help you sick piece of shit.

You need to stop drinking Obammy Kool-Aid!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: #OT# a different type of military program.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d30e11c5b3a6c5e6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 2:11 am
From: "kfvorwerk@gmail.com"

On Feb 14, 7:44 pm, F. George McDuffee <gmcduf...@mcduffee-
associates.us> wrote:
> From past postings it appears that many of our participants like
> cooking in addition to metalworking.
>
> If this is you, "The Grill Sergeants" is a video podcast series
> put out by the Pentagon/DoD that may be of interest. [MREs *NOT*
> featured]http://www.npr.org/templates/transcript/transcript.php?storyId=106749733
>
> http://www.pentagonchannel.mil/thegrillsergeants/index.shtml
>
> note that some of the services such as miro may provide better
> reception.http://www.miroguide.com/feeds/7482
> also seehttp://odeo.com/channels/2120330-The-Grill-Sergeants
>
> google on "The Grill Sergeants" for 140k hits.
>
> Unka George (George McDuffee)
> ..............................
> The past is a foreign country;
> they do things differently there.
> L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
> The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

One of the grill sergeants was on Throw Down with Bobby Flay.
Thanks
Karl

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Epoxy experts.....runny mess.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/fb07d83ca0cbca7c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 2:28 am
From: "Royston Vasey"

I'm trying to seal a printed circuit board into a PVC part I've turned out
on my lathe. The problem I'm having is the that the epoxy goes quite runny
as it goes through its curing process and some of it runs through small gaps
( <<0.5mm) where I'd prefer it didn't.

I'm using CW177 resin & HY177 hardener in the 5:1 mix recommended.

The data sheet is here:

http://www.meury.com.au/uploads/170666853166.pdf

I tried some rapid set epoxy (~90 seconds) but it turns to crap before I can
get it in where it needs to go.

It's not really practical to use anything else (like RTV, tape, hot glue or
wax etc) to seal the small gaps in the bottom of the assembly.

Has anyone played around with this type of problem?

thanks.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 4:31 am
From: "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"

"Royston Vasey" <royston@vasey.com> fired this volley in
news:0Mednebj7LBTvOTWnZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d@westnet.com.au:

> I'm trying to seal a printed circuit board into a PVC part I've turned
> out on my lathe. The problem I'm having is the that the epoxy goes
> quite runny as it goes through its curing process and some of it runs
> through small gaps ( <<0.5mm) where I'd prefer it didn't.
>
...
> Has anyone played around with this type of problem?
>

Yep. If you cannot seal the gaps (don't understand why you can't -- or
is it just too much trouble to do?), then you'll need to add a thixotrope
to the epoxy. Stirring will thin the material for pouring (thixotropic
== "shear thinning"). Remaining still will cause it to thicken; the
time-to-thicken and the degree of thickening are determined by the nature
of the thixotrope and how much you add.

LLoyd

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 4:59 am
From: Pete Keillor

On Mon, 15 Feb 2010 18:28:26 +0800, "Royston Vasey"
<royston@vasey.com> wrote:

>I'm trying to seal a printed circuit board into a PVC part I've turned out
>on my lathe. The problem I'm having is the that the epoxy goes quite runny
>as it goes through its curing process and some of it runs through small gaps
>( <<0.5mm) where I'd prefer it didn't.
>
>
>I'm using CW177 resin & HY177 hardener in the 5:1 mix recommended.
>
>The data sheet is here:
>
>http://www.meury.com.au/uploads/170666853166.pdf
>
>I tried some rapid set epoxy (~90 seconds) but it turns to crap before I can
>get it in where it needs to go.
>
>
>It's not really practical to use anything else (like RTV, tape, hot glue or
>wax etc) to seal the small gaps in the bottom of the assembly.
>
>Has anyone played around with this type of problem?
>
>thanks.
>
You can also get 5 and 30 minute epoxy. Either should be more viscous
than a casting resin, which is intended to be low viscosity to allow
bubbles to escape as well as fill small details.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:52 am
From: KG

On Mon, 15 Feb 2010 18:28:26 +0800, "Royston Vasey" <royston@vasey.com> wrote:

Talcum powder or baby powder to thicken resin if strength isn't an issue, chopped fibers if it is,
all are available at any good boat store such as West Marine.
*****************
Thank You kgsAT@msbx.net

To reply to this email please remove the AT
after the kgs in the reply to address as shown above.

Never ever under estimate the incompetent.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Lathe chuck spindle attachment
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/b76ae7f100af4f96?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 2:50 am
From: "Wild_Bill"

Some rotary tables can be motorized to run continuously while milling, but I
expect that some of the light duty RTs should probably just be used for
positioning.

I was using a motorized RT for a while, and it seemed to work very well
(hobby, not production speeds & feeds). I used a small Oriental Motor
gearmotor, chain and sprockets and a Phase II 6" horizontal RT.
The RT was turning very slowly, less than 2 RPM, maybe considerably slower.
It's a method I wanted to try, for cutting disks from sheet/plate stock
without center holes.

--
WB
.........

"Michael Koblic" <mkoblic@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hlaiue01ur8@news6.newsguy.com...
>
snips

> BTW can you put a motor drive on a rotary table so it turns at a constant
> rate?
>
> --
> Michael Koblic,
> Campbell River, BC

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:15 am
From: Jim Wilkins

On Feb 14, 11:35 pm, "Michael Koblic" <mkob...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Jim Wilkins" <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> ...
> > I attach a pivot post to the table of the mill, ...
> Those would be the GT18 steering sectors?

That piece fit on the lathe after sawing it roughly to size. I clamped
the square blank flat on the bandsaw table with tee bolts to cut off
the corners. Then I set the saw upright and followed a scribed circle
as far as the wide blade allows, then opened up the kerf with a chisel
to make clearance the next cut.

> > If the disk can be clamped firmly to the mill table, ...

> I have to digest this...

The upright pivot post is held in the vise, the disk rests on 1-2-3
blocks which raise it above the jaw tops. Tee slot clamp bolts clamp
the disk onto the 1-2-3 blocks, leaving a small space in between to
mill tangents to the OD. It's slower than sawing because of all the
reclamping but doesn't risk cutting in too far by accident, and leaves
only a little metal for the lathe to remove.

> > For even larger circles I set them up on a shaft and round them with
> > an angle grinder, ...Think of an old foot-pedal grindstone frame. You
> > could spin the disk with a sanding drum in a drill.
>
> I think you mentioned this to me before. In fact I believe it was the
> inspiration for this marvel of technology:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/27683124@N07/sets/72157607743618739/
> Michael Koblic,

The ladder-shaped frame of my sawmill is the model. Both wheels needed
truing and the front one considerable flattening. I used the
crosspieces at the inner ends of the wheels for tool rests, ie to hold
the grinder steady.

You could make a similar frame out of wood by laminating 2x4's with
the ends alternating to form glued finger joints. I'd make two side-by-
side rectangular bays, the second providing a tool rest for faceplate
turning.

The faceplate could be a large pulley faced with plywood. The bearings
on the motorcycle wheels were tight enough to use one as a lathe
faceplate, though the protruding axle interferes. If you did that you
could drive the tire by friction or remove it and run a vee belt on
the rim. I used the sprocket only because I needed to transmit several
horsepower, it required a separate countershaft.

I think an X-Y table would be stiff enough for a tool rest. I acquired
one plus the headstock from a scrapped SB lathe and a brake lathe
tailstock to build a large wheel lathe, but haven't needed to set it
up yet.

jsw

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Drop in December new-home sales fuels concern over recent gains Re: US
economy grows at fastest rate in 6 years
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/b65ecc276c719e1a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 3:28 am
From: "John R. Carroll"

Ed Huntress wrote:
> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
> news:AK6dnY_Ws-8kEevWnZ2dnUVZ_tednZ2d@giganews.com...
>> Ed Huntress wrote:
>>> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
>>> news:TqednYZLdPc7w-3WnZ2dnUVZ_vCdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>> Ed Huntress wrote:
>>>>> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
>>>>> news:FZydnSR_a_sYoO3WnZ2dnUVZ_qGdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>>>> Ed Huntress wrote:
>>>>>>> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:JdCdncGpZYEXqe3WnZ2dnUVZ_qidnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>>>>>> Ed Huntress wrote:
>>>>>>>>> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:VYudnam3QLH1DfLWnZ2dnUVZ_sGdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>>>>>>>> Ed Huntress wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>> news:dsKdnexl1cLU3vXWnZ2dnUVZ_gadnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>>>>>>>>>> Ed Huntress wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:1d2dnUYH4ZhxqfXWnZ2dnUVZ_uWdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ed Huntress wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "F. George McDuffee" <gmcduffee@mcduffee-associates.us>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:1evem556i8ojcr2dnu0bcqu4gv22t6n1lg@4ax.com...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 1 Feb 2010 19:51:07 -0500, "Ed Huntress"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <snip>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> So principle, yes, possibilities -- I'd have to see. It's easy to
>>>>> say that this is what we have to do. It's much harder to say how
>>>>> we can do it, in terms of politics as well as money.
>>>>
>>>> http://tinyurl.com/ylkbqga
>>>
>>> Gosh. A $189.00 book, and only five left! <g>
>>>
>>> If I need another topic, I'll look into it. Meantime, it looks like
>>> a subject just as big as the one I'm working on, and more difficult
>>> because it's moving faster.
>>>
>>> Can you tell us the Reader's Digest version? d8-)
>>
>> I don't have a crystal ball.
>> There are, however, several clear trends that are increasingly
>> obvious though.
>> One that you have probably noticed is the shift in emphasis away from
>> personal transportation.
>> Kids today, for example, are far less concerned about squiring
>> themselves around. Increasing numbers of teenagers and young adults
>> aren't bothering to
>> obtain a driving license until doing so can't be avoided. Personal
>> transportation is an expense they avoid and an annoying use of
>> capital once
>> they can't. Purchases are based almost exclusively on functional
>> value blended with the desire to minimize any outlay of capital.
>> This, for American's, represents a fundamental cultural shift. We
>> are maturing as a society and our economy reflects this.
>>
>> Government has always lead the way into the future, not just in
>> America, but
>> the world. Silicon Valley was built by entrepreneurs but they
>> leveraged technology that flowed from the investments made in basic
>> research funded or
>> encouraged by Uncle Sam that was leveraged by the private sector.
>> Cisco, for
>> instance, is the result of the transfer of intellectual property
>> from the public to private sector.
>>
>>
>>>
>>> For the record, here's the kind of junk that starts populating my
>>> mind when we start talking about a subject like this. You mention
>>> all-electric cars; my question is, with lithium-ion batteries?
>>> Maybe. Maybe not. And fuel cells -- they've been working on them
>>> for over 40 years. When are they going to make one that someone
>>> could actually buy?
>>
>> You could buy a vehicle powered by hydrogen fuel cell technology
>> today. Ford has been running a small fleet for several years now,
>> for example. What
>> is lacking is an application of national will.
>> Tom Friedman wrote an interesting piece about his experience at
>> Davos this year. Did you see it?
>
> Yeah. I'm a skeptic about command economies, even hybrids like Japan
> 30 years ago, or China now.

The San Francisco building code will soon be revised to require that new
structures be wired for car chargers. Across the street from City Hall, some
drivers are already plugging converted hybrids into a row of charging
stations.

In nearby Silicon Valley, companies are ordering workplace charging stations
in the belief that their employees will be first in line when electric cars
begin arriving in showrooms. And at the headquarters of Pacific Gas and
Electric, utility executives are preparing "heat maps" of neighborhoods that
they fear may overload the power grid in their exuberance for electric cars.

"There is a huge momentum here," said Andrew Tang, an executive at P.G.& E.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/15/business/15electric.html?hpw

--
John R. Carroll

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Coating for polished brass
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/45bf22c635bf1547?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 4:54 am
From: Pete Keillor

On Sun, 14 Feb 2010 22:44:17 -0800, gk <glkd@cox.net> wrote:

>Anyone know what material is used to coat polished brass (to prevent
>tarnishing) such as bathroom fixtures? I appears to be much tougher than
>clear lacquer. Polyurethane, maybe? Any info will be appreciated.
>
>Gary

I once worked on an epoxy solid resin for a clear powder coat. That
was for high end stuff like Moen, Kohler.

Pete Keillor

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Sorta OT... Metal Shipping Containers (Ocean) Anyone?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/99b158157107dc2e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:06 am
From: "Joe AutoDrill"

Anyone have a good source for full sized shipping containers at a decent
cost or donation to a charity?

Looking for one or two that are still able to be shipped (good condition) to
send overseas for a charity in a few months...

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://Production-Tapping-Equipment.com/
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill

V8013-R

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What is it? Set 323
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/92e19f4cef16be55?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:05 am
From: "Stormin Mormon"

Thanks. I've never seen that design of nozzle.

As to "today straight stream is preferred". My
experience with fire fighting, some years ago.
Both have their times and their uses. As I
remember hearing, in the early days of fire hoses,
solid stream was all that was made. Eventually
someone noticed that a fog pattern had its uses.
One of the nozzles I remember seeing on a truck
had a pull handle to turn it on, and you could
select stream (water came out one hole) or spray
pattern (water came out several holes) by pulling
the handle more or less. Some nozzles now days
have a ring near the opening handle that allows
the operator to adjust the GPM, galons per minute.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Rob H." <rhvp65@gmail.com>
wrote in message
news:hl4kc90vs7@news4.newsguy.com...

>
> Repeating yesterday's post:
> 1849. I recall seeing one of these back in the
> early '60's. It was
> screwed
> onto the end of a large fabric hose, much like a
> fireman's hose. The
> other
> end of the hose wasn't attached to anything. I
> assumed it was to provide
> a circular spray pattern to the water but I
> never knew for sure.
> Art

Yes, this is correct, it's a nozzle for a
fireman's hose, somehow I didn't
see your post yesterday.

Tough set this week, no answers yet on the two
unidentified items, the rest
of the answers can be seen here:

http://55tools.blogspot.com/2010/02/set-323.html#answers

Rob

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The last American Chopper (was Gene Haas)
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/66ea8fd2ec7da870?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:33 am
From: Randy

I did not see the episode with Gene Haas, but I did catch part of the
show which is supposed to be their last.. They were going to build a
Kobalt bike for Lowes. My only thought was...... it's not a true
Kobalt bike unless it's built in China like all the Kobalt tools.

Thank You,
Randy

Remove 333 from email address to reply.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How many layers of oil paint
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/41f7ccd7ea60daf5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:40 am
From: "dcaster@krl.org"

On Feb 9, 2:19 pm, Ignoramus11495 <ignoramus11...@NOSPAM.
11495.invalid> wrote:

> The question is how many layers of primer and paint is best. I was
> planning on two layers of primer and two layers of paint. This means
> that it takes four days to paint something, with one day per layer due
> to drying time.
>
> i

I happened to meet a couple of Du Pont engineers visiting from
Germany.
They work for the car paint division. And asked one about painting,
specifically about how many coats of primer. He said one coat of
primer.
But then added that they are in the midst of rolling out the second
generation of water based automotive paint. It consists of a base
coat with the color and a clear top coat. NO PRIMER.

That sounds pretty neat to me. Automotive paint which ought to stand
up to exterior conditions. Just one coat if you don't need a clear
coat. And water clean up. Will have to see if I can find out more.

Dan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Socket on a stick
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/3ba92c2af2af060e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 5:47 am
From: KG

On Mon, 15 Feb 2010 00:24:32 -0600, Don Foreman <dforeman@NOSPAMgoldengate.net> wrote:

>On Sat, 13 Feb 2010 11:24:25 -0600, Tim Wescott <tim@seemywebsite.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 13 Feb 2010 09:11:06 -0800, Jon Danniken wrote:
>>
>>> Here a tool I made this week, I call it a socket on a stick. I made it
>>> to attach the water lines to my bathroom sink, as there isn't enough
>>> clearance up there to tighten it with a wrench (you can barely get yer
>>> fingers up in there).
>>>
>>> The socket was fifty cents from a pawnshop, which was cut using a thin
>>> abrasive disk in an angle grinder. I left a small shoulder on the base
>>> of the socket to keep it from sliding off of the hexagon nut it will
>>> tighten.
>>>
>>> The socket and the stick were welded together using 6013 GMAW rod and a
>>> Miller buzzbox; I was very surprised at how easy it was to weld these
>>> together (yes my welds look like turkeysh*t, but they will function in
>>> this application).
>>>
>>> Here's a few more thousand words:
>>>
>>> http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/SocketStick01.jpg
>>> http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/SocketStick02.jpg
>>> http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/SocketStick03.jpg
>>> http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/SocketStick04.jpg
>>>
>>> Jon
>>
>>So like a crow's foot, only a lot weaker?
>>
>>(Ignore the snarkiness -- that's just to keep in shape).
>
>Sometimes a tool like this will fit where a crow's foot won't. I've
>made and used tools like this. One such was for the top of the rear
>struts of VW Rabbits.
>
>As you frequently come to this group with questions for free help to
>aid your quests for profit on EBay, perhaps you snarkiness might be
>better practiced elsewhere?

One HELL of a great IDEA, thanks
*****************
Thank You kgsAT@msbx.net

To reply to this email please remove the AT
after the kgs in the reply to address as shown above.

Never ever under estimate the incompetent.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Feb 15 2010 6:02 am
From: "Snag"

Bob La Londe wrote:
> "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" <lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote in message
> news:Xns9D1F574101973lloydspmindspringcom@216.168.3.70...
>> "Bob La Londe" <nospam@nospam.no> fired this volley in
>> news:hl83g8$3kb$1 @news.eternal-september.org:
>>
>>> Nice, I've got a few custom by chop saw and welder sockets myself. So a
>>> basin wrench wouldn't fit?
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Basin wrench? BASIN WRENCH? They make something to DO that job?
>
> I've got two or three of them.
>
>> <G<G>G>
>>
>> (Also -- oxygen sensor wrench;
>
> Don't have one of those. (Maybe I do and didn't know what it was
> called.)
>> fuel line fitting wrench;...
>
> Yeah, its called a bone wrench. I have a whole set of them.
>
> ad nauseum)
>>
>
> Well, of course. Harley makes a custom deep socket for EVO clutch
> nuts too. I cut a socket in half and welded a piece of pipe in the
> middle for mine.

The O2 sensor wrench is basically a socket with a slot up the side for the
wires . And I made my SPROCKET nut wrench for the Harley too , same way you
did - and it also fits Shovelhead and TC sprocket/pulley nuts .
And I really wish I had a set of tubing fitting wrenchs ...
--
Snag
"90 FLHTCU "Strider"
'39 WLDD "PopCycle"
BS 132/SENS/DOF

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Monday, February 15, 2010

rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 17 topics - digest

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