twitter: rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 14 topics

rec.crafts.metalworking
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking?hl=en

rec.crafts.metalworking@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hobart Gasoline Welder
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/ec8d843faba8846b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 12:02 am
From: "Bob Noble"

Look at the engine fan blades in the picture. There is no shield around them
when the sides are open. The sides are unusually raised to run it and when
those blades are spinning, they can't be seen and it's real easy to get your
fingers in there if you poke at something and don't see the fan.
Trust me on this. I just thought I was stupid when it happened to me, but
when my uncle did it too and got hurt way worse than me, I recognized the
safety problem.

--
Bob Noble
http://www.sonic.net/bnoble

"Gunner Asch" <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:bju3p51qqs5169o2pev8ugeded4nhtapii@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 5 Mar 2010 20:55:52 -0800, "Bob Noble" <bnoble@sonic.net> wrote:
>
>>Had lots of similar types in Nam when I was there.
>>Watch out for the fan blades when it is running as there is no shroud when
>>the sides are up.
>>I got my fingers in there and bloodied good when I was there.
>>And to top that off, my uncle had one and did the same thing a few years
>>ago.
>
>
> Which fan blades? Generator or engine? Generator blades are open on
> the bottom of the generator housing..the engine fan is tucked in behind
> the radiator nicely.
>
> Gunner

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 1:46 am
From: Gunner Asch

On Sat, 6 Mar 2010 00:02:53 -0800, "Bob Noble" <bnoble@sonic.net> wrote:

>Look at the engine fan blades in the picture. There is no shield around them
>when the sides are open. The sides are unusually raised to run it and when
>those blades are spinning, they can't be seen and it's real easy to get your
>fingers in there if you poke at something and don't see the fan.
>Trust me on this. I just thought I was stupid when it happened to me, but
>when my uncle did it too and got hurt way worse than me, I recognized the
>safety problem.

Thanks! Ill pay particular attention when I try starting it. Rotating
knife blades turning at 1500 rpm make me nervous when it involves my
fingers.

Gunner

Whenever a Liberal utters the term "Common Sense approach"....grab your
wallet, your ass, and your guns because the sombitch is about to do
something damned nasty to all three of them.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: FS -- 275 amp Pipeline Welder, Continental 163 engine
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/dc43134cee7f371e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 12:57 am
From: Gunner Asch

On Fri, 5 Mar 2010 19:33:56 -0700, "JTMcC" <firstrateYUPfab@citlink.net>
wrote:

>
>"Gunner Asch" <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:7ip1p5tnh7vvle6i8dc0k2qppfmdju7ufn@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 16 Feb 2010 15:39:57 -0700, "JTMcC"
>> <firstrateYUPfab@citlink.net> wrote:
>>
>>>I am a pipeliner and have been for a long time.
>>>A "pipeliner" is any of the various versions of the SA-200 from the 40's
>>>till today.
>>>There's really no such thing as a 375 amp pipeliner unless you're
>>>describing
>>>a SA-200, and they will make up to and over 400 amps maxed out.
>>>SA-200's are the only machines that are termed "pipeliners", even tho
>>>there
>>>are a few other machines in common use in the field.
>>>So I ask, again, what the heck is a 375 amp pipeliner?
>>>
>>>JTMcC, Pipeline Welder
>>
>> Its a Miller
>>
>> And the Miller 55G (which I have) is considered a "pipeliner" here in
>> the California errral patch. 400 amps, CV/CC
>>
>> Gunner
>
>
>No it's really not, I've burned several rods in "your" patch, and oil field
>work is not pipelineing. Mainline construction differs greatly from the
>gathering systems and related work in your area.
>There are a lot of machines used in the oil fields that aren't applicable to
>pipeline construction.
>
>JTMcC.

Ok. Your opinion is noted. Thanks!

Gunner

>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"john" <amdinc@intergrafix.net> wrote in message
>>>news:Va2dnR8pdKtKiubWnZ2dnUVZ_tudnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>> Ignoramus21666 wrote:
>>>>> On 2010-02-16, JTMcC<firstrateYUPfab@citlink.net> wrote:
>>>>>> What the heck is a "375 amp pipeline welder"?
>>>>>
>>>>> A welder to weld pipelines maybe? with 375 amps of current?
>>>>>
>>>>> i
>>>>>
>>>>>> JTMcC.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Ignoramus12951"<ignoramus12951@NOSPAM.12951.invalid> wrote in
>>>>>> message
>>>>>> news:CsednYdfkPLOm-fWnZ2dnUVZ_u-dnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>>>>>> On 2010-02-16, Ignoramus12951<ignoramus12951@NOSPAM.12951.invalid>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Works great and comes with a 4 wheeled trailer. This is a "big one",
>>>>>>>> not a little 200a welder. Nice external appearance. New waterpump
>>>>>>>> etc. Big leads also included.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Make it 375 amps, not 275.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also it has both CC and CV mode.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also, one of the wheels mounting plates (to which the wheel is
>>>>>>> bolted)
>>>>>>> is missing a chunk. I am sure it needs to be replaced.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also the trailer has no springs. I just drove it for 50 miles and I
>>>>>>> know that it works, but it is a little bumpy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> i
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pintle hitch. No lights on trailer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Price for rec.crafts.metalworking readers is less than I expect to
>>>>>>>> get
>>>>>>>> elsewhere.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> i
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> A Pipeliner Welder is a brand name of Lincoln Electric used to do heavy
>>>> welding in the field, pipeline welding being one of its uses from where
>>>> they took the name.
>>>>
>>>> John
>>>
>>
>> Whenever a Liberal utters the term "Common Sense approach"....grab your
>> wallet, your ass, and your guns because the sombitch is about to do
>> something damned nasty to all three of them.
>

Whenever a Liberal utters the term "Common Sense approach"....grab your
wallet, your ass, and your guns because the sombitch is about to do
something damned nasty to all three of them.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Annealing brass and other non ferrous metals
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/cc3bc555e909fa61?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 1:43 am
From: Gunner Asch

On Sat, 6 Mar 2010 08:44:36 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
<stevenospam@lusardi.de> wrote:

>Gunner,
>I do not normally disagree with you, but this time for sure. Lead hardening is performed by alloying the lead with other elements,
>not heat treatment.
>Steve

<G>

Take your basic batch of wheel weight lead..which Brinnels about
9-10..and as you cast each one, dump it into a 5 gal bucket of water.

Measure them again in 3 days for hardness. You will find that they
hardened up to about 21-23 Brinnel and will stay that way for at least 4
yrs.

Dont believe me?

http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting/alloyhardness/index.asp

http://www.lasc.us/HeatTreat.htm

I cast nearly all my rifle bullets over a 5 gallon bucket of water. I
average Brinell of 21 with basic wheelweights after a couple days and if
I use a Lead/Antimony alloy...I can get up to nearly 35 Brinell.

They will heat treat to 2.5-3.5x the hardness of the unheat treated
metal.

<G>

Gunner

>
>"Gunner Asch" <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in message news:a2q3p5hmmh046qmvm78qis7sflln20v5ed@4ax.com...
>> On Fri, 05 Mar 2010 20:08:22 -0500, Wes <clutch@lycos.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Guy at work swore up and down that you have to quench non ferous metals to get the softest
>>>annealing.
>>>
>>>I've annealed case mouths on rifle cartridges standing in shallow water and then tipped
>>>them over into the water just to cool them. The standing water level kept the case body
>>>from being annealed. Was I missing something there? I'm thinking he is FOS.
>>>
>>>Wes
>>
>>
>> Some non ferrous metals harden when quenched. Others, such as
>> brass..soften.
>>
>> Lead as an example, hardens when quenched.
>>
>> Gunner
>>
>> Whenever a Liberal utters the term "Common Sense approach"....grab your
>> wallet, your ass, and your guns because the sombitch is about to do
>> something damned nasty to all three of them.

Whenever a Liberal utters the term "Common Sense approach"....grab your
wallet, your ass, and your guns because the sombitch is about to do
something damned nasty to all three of them.

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 4:46 am
From: "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"

"Steve Lusardi" <stevenospam@lusardi.de> fired this volley in
news:hmt15a$fad$00$1@news.t-online.com:

> Gunner,
> I do not normally disagree with you, but this time for sure. Lead
> hardening is performed by alloying the lead with other elements, not
> heat treatment. Steve

Gunner's right on this one. Ball milling media made from lead alloys is
quench-hardened.

LLoyd

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 5:12 am
From: Jim Wilkins

On Mar 5, 11:18 pm, "Royston Vasey" <roys...@vasey.com> wrote:
> ...
> For copper gasket washers that have age/work hardened - heat them up &
> quench to soften & re-use.

When forming copper sheet and tube I usually heat to visible red and
DON'T quench, the metal seems to be equally soft either way. However
immediate quenching does reduce surface oxidation.

jsw

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 5:58 am
From: "dcaster@krl.org"

On Mar 6, 1:12 pm, Jim Wilkins <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mar 5, 11:18 pm, "Royston Vasey" <roys...@vasey.com> wrote:
>
> > ...
> > For copper gasket washers that have age/work hardened - heat them up &
> > quench to soften & re-use.
>
> When forming copper sheet and tube I usually heat to visible red and
> DON'T quench, the metal seems to be equally soft either way. However
> immediate quenching does reduce surface oxidation.
>
> jsw

Right. The quenching has no effect on copper and brass, other than it
makes no difference and if you quench you can handle the material
immediately. I suspect the same is true of lead alloys. ie they do
age harden whether one quenches them or not.

Gunner, have you ever not quenched a few bullets and checked the
hardness after a couple of days.

Dan

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 6:24 am
From: "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"

"dcaster@krl.org" <dcaster@krl.org> fired this volley in news:21355932-
1981-4e2d-a3a0-1a05ad42f792@g19g2000yqe.googlegroups.com:
>I suspect the same is true of lead alloys. ie they do
> age harden whether one quenches them or not.
>
> Gunner, have you ever not quenched a few bullets and checked the
> hardness after a couple of days.

They'll also quench harden if the alloy contains a little antimony. Then
they age soften.

Check out this fairly good writeup:

http://www.tacticoolproducts.com/bullethardness/

I have a friend who is an antique weapons expert -- probably as well versed
on things over 75 years old than all but a small handful of people in the
world. His opinions, which I'd respect more than any web referece, is that
lead can be (surface) hardened by quenching.

LLoyd

==============================================================================
TOPIC: I was almost impounded, laptop saved me
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/22b99ed7799b84db?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 2:04 am
From: "Pete C."

Joe Pfeiffer wrote:
>
> "Pete C." <aux3.DOH.4@snet.net> writes:
> >
> > I haven't heard of a class D license before, both states I've been in
> > didn't have anything below C. You should probably look into upgrading to
> > a C. I expect it's just an excuse to charge more for the upgraded
> > license, but it will at least put you on par with what most states have
> > as the base license.
>
> googlegooglegoogle... in NM, the standard noncommercial license is a
> Class D.

Google is crap. Altavista is vastly better.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 2:06 am
From: "Pete C."

"Pete C." wrote:
>
> Ignoramus28336 wrote:
> >
> > On 2010-03-05, Wes <clutch@lycos.com> wrote:
> > > Ignoramus28336 <ignoramus28336@NOSPAM.28336.invalid> wrote:
> > >
> > >>details later
> > >
> > > Well since you managed to post this it sounds like you are walking free. Curiousity
> > > piqued.
> >
> > I rented a lowboy and picked up the mill. I was going slowly and
> > stoped to check that the straps are tight. A police car pulled by and
> > the officer asked if I was OK, I said yes, thank you Sir. After a few
> > words exchanged, I continued on my way. The policeman followed me a
> > bit and then flashed his lights. This time he asked for DL and
> > insurance, which I produced. He told me that my truck was missing some
> > kind of sticker about its certification to carry weight. I do not
> > remember what it is exactly and will find out.
> >
> > Then he came back and told me that my class D drivers license allows
> > me to only pull vehicles with total weight rating of up to 22,000 lbs
> > (says on the license), and the capacity of my vehicle and trailer was
> > 26,000 lbs. So, according to them (another one pulled up) I was in
> > violation and not permitted to drive this weight rating due to
> > deficient drivers license. My trailer was to be impounded (it is a
> > rental!) and the impound fee was $500.
> >
> > I was, as you can imagine, very excited about the prospect of this
> > mill being snowed on in the impound lot while I find ways to get it
> > out or get a Class C license. The impound fee was what I paid for the
> > mill.
> >
> > Then a tow truck pulled by to impound my trailer.
> >
> > I asked the police officers "are you sure about this" and they said
> > yes, and yet I wondered how a rental agency would let me rent this.
> >
> > I had a laptop with me and it had a special wireless broadband
> > card. So, I googled "Illinois class C license weight" and found this
> > page:
> >
> > http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/drivers/drivers_license/il_license_class.html
> >
> > It said that Class D license allows: ``Any single vehicle with a GVWR
> > of 16,000 pounds or less towing any vehicle providing the GCWR does
> > not exceed 26,000 pounds.''
> >
> > I was not exceeding that. The rental guys did not give me a trailer
> > that I could not tow.
> >
> > I showed this to the police officers , they talked a bit and then told
> > me that they are giving me the "benefit of the doubt" and that
> > Illinois is all screwed up because of conflicting laws. I ended up
> > still being fined with that sticker fine, but let go. Not many people
> > drive away happy because of a police stop and a $75 fine.
> >
> > So I wonder whether this was an honest mistake on their part, or
> > not. I tend to think that it was an honest mistake on their part.
> >
> > i
>
> Fun stuff.
>
> Probably a good idea to print out all potentially relevant laws and keep
> them in the truck for any future fun.
>
> I haven't heard of a class D license before, both states I've been in
> didn't have anything below C. You should probably look into upgrading to
> a C. I expect it's just an excuse to charge more for the upgraded
> license, but it will at least put you on par with what most states have
> as the base license.

You should also investigate that mysterious "weight sticker" thing. 90%
probability you will find that it is not applicable to non-commercial
vehicles.

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 6:01 am
From: "RogerN"

"Ignoramus28336" <ignoramus28336@NOSPAM.28336.invalid> wrote in message
news:WJednfHkR_qiXgzWnZ2dnUVZ_vWdnZ2d@giganews.com...
> On 2010-03-05, Wes <clutch@lycos.com> wrote:
>> Ignoramus28336 <ignoramus28336@NOSPAM.28336.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>details later
>>
>> Well since you managed to post this it sounds like you are walking free.
>> Curiousity
>> piqued.
>
> I rented a lowboy and picked up the mill. I was going slowly and
> stoped to check that the straps are tight. A police car pulled by and
> the officer asked if I was OK, I said yes, thank you Sir. After a few
> words exchanged, I continued on my way. The policeman followed me a
> bit and then flashed his lights. This time he asked for DL and
> insurance, which I produced. He told me that my truck was missing some
> kind of sticker about its certification to carry weight. I do not
> remember what it is exactly and will find out.
>
> Then he came back and told me that my class D drivers license allows
> me to only pull vehicles with total weight rating of up to 22,000 lbs
> (says on the license), and the capacity of my vehicle and trailer was
> 26,000 lbs. So, according to them (another one pulled up) I was in
> violation and not permitted to drive this weight rating due to
> deficient drivers license. My trailer was to be impounded (it is a
> rental!) and the impound fee was $500.
>
> I was, as you can imagine, very excited about the prospect of this
> mill being snowed on in the impound lot while I find ways to get it
> out or get a Class C license. The impound fee was what I paid for the
> mill.
>
> Then a tow truck pulled by to impound my trailer.
>
> I asked the police officers "are you sure about this" and they said
> yes, and yet I wondered how a rental agency would let me rent this.
>
> I had a laptop with me and it had a special wireless broadband
> card. So, I googled "Illinois class C license weight" and found this
> page:
>
> http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/drivers/drivers_license/il_license_class.html
>
> It said that Class D license allows: ``Any single vehicle with a GVWR
> of 16,000 pounds or less towing any vehicle providing the GCWR does
> not exceed 26,000 pounds.''
>
> I was not exceeding that. The rental guys did not give me a trailer
> that I could not tow.
>
> I showed this to the police officers , they talked a bit and then told
> me that they are giving me the "benefit of the doubt" and that
> Illinois is all screwed up because of conflicting laws. I ended up
> still being fined with that sticker fine, but let go. Not many people
> drive away happy because of a police stop and a $75 fine.
>
> So I wonder whether this was an honest mistake on their part, or
> not. I tend to think that it was an honest mistake on their part.
>
> i

It's bad that you need a laptop and wireless broadband because the police
don't know the law. I guess it's guilty until proven innocent? I just wish
you could sue the police for trying to impound you because of their mistake,
they need to be held accountable for their actions. They will have to be
more careful and make sure not to pull over people with wireless broadband.

I have a 1 ton pickup truck and always thought it would be nice to have a
large capacity trailer so I could take my forklift with me to a machinery
auction and haul some toys home.

RogerN

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Bibles Wanted !
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/f2e06ad69080532c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 2:13 am
From: "Harold & Susan Vordos"

"Doug Miller" <spambait@milmac.com> wrote in message
news:hmque3$79m$2@news.eternal-september.org...
> In article <5X1kn.83$Sp1.49@newsreading01.news.tds.net>, "Harold & Susan
> Vordos" <vordos@tds.net> wrote:
>
>>I don't believe it. There is no evidence that the sun has ever "stopped
>>in
>>the sky", nor is that a conceivable notion. The closest you might come
>>to
>>such nonsense is the fact that the earth's gravitational field changes
>>position with some long term regularity.
>
> Ummm.... no, it doesn't. That would be the earth's *magnetic* field. (Note
> peripheral metalworking context)
>
>> That's hardly the same thing.
>
> Indeed.

Oooops, a senior moment. Glad you understood what I meant.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 4:34 am
From: Cliff

On Sat, 06 Mar 2010 00:29:58 -0600, Lookout <mrLookout@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Fri, 05 Mar 2010 19:51:11 -0700, "Paul Hovnanian P.E."
><Paul@Hovnanian.com> wrote:
>
>>There is nothing as disconcerting as having your daughter come home at
>>4:00 AM carrying a Gideon's bible.
>
>HAHAHA No shit!
>
>It was just 10 years ago I had to threaten the local school system
>with a law suit because they were handing out bibles. Can you believe
>they were still trying to get away with that shit in the South?

Yep.
--
Cliff

==============================================================================
TOPIC: DIY Two-Stroke Engine
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/bcf5d37475198771?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 2:14 am
From: cncmillgil

On Mar 5, 7:56 pm, durabol <durabo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> For the last few years I have toyed with the idea of building a
> homemade two-stroke engine for UL use. What keyed my interest was
> reading about homemade model aircraft engines and reading and watching
> a re-enactment of the Wright brother's first flight with a replica
> engine (not a two-stroke engine).
>
> Has anyone made a 2-stroke engine from scratch? One may need to cast
> aluminium, may need a lathe and milling machine with boring head and
> hone or perhaps the boring and honing of the cylinder and bearing
> journals could be farmed out. A commercial carburetor and piston could
> be used. Two-stroke engines seem simple enough that home construction
> may be possible, if not practical.
>
> A direct drive engine will be that much heavier when you take into
> account the weight of the drive reduction system. I have calculated
> the weight of an 80x80mm bore and stroke 2 cylinder opposed engine and
> it was a bit under 40lbs which should give about 1hp/lbs. I used 10mm
> cylinder and crankcase wall thickness and a 1.25" dia crank.
>
> I have got some idea of port-time-area from the freeware computer
> program called "BiMotion". I'm not sure how good the data is for
> lowish speed engines but I guess it is a start. I have also worked up
> a spreadsheet for similar information.
>
> I don't think a reed valve system is needed for this engine since it
> is only going to operate at a fairly narrow rpm range and the port
> timing isn't critical. Piston ported valves offer similar performance
> to other induction types but only over a narrow rpm range which is
> what I have planned for the engine. I plan to build an engine with a
> restrictive exhaust to ensure no fuel escapes. I have heard that
> piston ported engines can spit some fuel out of the carb at idle but
> this doesn't seem like a major problem. Rotary valves via crank shaft
> induction (disk or drum valves as well) is an interesting idea but I
> don't think I need the critical timing they provide.
>
> I was planning on using the largest two-stroke piston (not a diesel
> piston) I could find and using the largest stoke that was reasonable,
> something like 90x105mm
>
> Brock

Brock, you do have some ambition with a project like that. Sounds like
your basically re-inventing the wheel. Just my opinion, wouldn't it be
more cost effective & easier in the long run finding an antique wing
dinger & rebuild that? I've seen some pretty cool 2strokes over the
years. You've eliminated all those engineering variables that your
scratching your head about. When done, you have restored piece of
history, & may be $worth$ more that what you have into it? Again thats
just me, I dont like re-inventing the wheel. Some very smart guys
already did that. I like improving that wheel & making it spin faster.
The rotary wrankel engines have always intrigued me. Very simple,
compact, comparable with 2 stroke & can be made w/o a lot of
castings.

Good luck!

--
\|||/
(o o)
______.oOO-(_)-OOo.____________________
~ Gil ~
the HOLDZEM©® king
Member of
==American Toolmakers==
using the "old world" ways
with yesterdays technology
building
Tomorrows Dreams
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280451279735

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Wingers keep lying !!!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/3e88a3bd89afa214?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 3:24 am
From: Cliff

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/03/06/karl.rove.book/?hpt=T2
""[D]id Bush lie us into war? Absolutely not," Rove wrote "
""Would the Iraq War have occurred without WMD? I doubt it," he wrote.
"Congress was very unlikely to have supported the use-of-force resolution
without the threat of WMD."

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Sarah Palin Promotional Spot
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/48e691141bc9adec?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 3:34 am
From: Cliff

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steven-weber/sarah-palin-promotional-s_b_487584.html
"Sarah Palin Promotional Spot (Version 1)"
[
(She stands with her back to us, set against a big, blue sky)

Announcer: The Shnook of the North has sallied forth and taken the world by
storm!

She's the biggest thing since white bread---and just as nutritious!

She left 'em hangin' in Alaska and keeps us guessin' in the lower 48 but there's
no mystery as to what she's up to now!

She's rollin' in green and White House bound!

She's raided the giftin' rooms!

She's slashed her speakin' fee!

She's lowered the intellectual bar even further than W (holy cow!) and passed
the savin's onto you!

What's that you say?

She's not qualified?

She's a teabaggin' tease all too eager to please the noxious seas of right wing
sleaze?
.....
]

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Socialist Palin works for Hugo Chavez
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/f61df2ea3be7edbb?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 3:49 am
From: Cliff

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/akmuckraker/the-palins-socialist-snow_b_488015.html
[
....
But, a closer look shows us that the Palins seem to be padding their pockets
from a surprising source.

It turns out that Mystik Lubricants is owned by... wait for it ... Citgo. Yes,
that same Citgo that's owned by Venezuela. Socialist Venezuela. Socialist, Hugo
Chavez lovin', Venezuela.

Oops.

Guess they should have heeded the advice Sarah Palin gave to President Obama:

"Now is not the time to experiment with socialism!"

The socialist snowmachine even makes an appearance in a recent commercial for
this year's Iditarod Sled Dog Race.
....
]

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Palin's Book on American Values: Quitting
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/0e4acab742960cde?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 3:55 am
From: Cliff

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/andy-borowitz/chapter-one-of-palins-boo_b_487256.html
"Chapter One of Palin's Book on American Values: Quitting"
[
The Borowitz Report has obtained the manuscript of former Alaska Governor Sarah
Palin's forthcoming book on American values. The following is Chapter One:
Quitting.

As far as American values are going, there is nothing more American in terms of
values than quitting.

After all, quitting is what made America be America in the first place. If we
hadn't decided to quit being a part of Britain, where would we be now? Not in
America, that's for darn sure.

In America, we can quit any darn thing, any darn time, without any darn warning.
If we want to quit writing a book, we can quit right in the middle of a
]

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Educating Palin ??????
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/943320276cebeb7a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 4:27 am
From: Cliff

On Wed, 03 Mar 2010 11:46:45 -0600, "RD (The Sandman)"
<rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote:

>Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>news:49qso5hhuff2vglso2b6g5e4isd3j56379@4ax.com:
>
>> On Tue, 02 Mar 2010 12:57:22 -0600, "RD (The Sandman)"
>> <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>>news:q40qo51ma8mh4kptii10umn2h4u6a9vsnt@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 27 Feb 2010 14:44:41 -0600, "RD (The Sandman)"
>>>> <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>>>>news:c2eho55pv6tu7jqbpgca5uafn6jild2fll@4ax.com:
>>>>>
>>>>>> http://rawstory.com/2010/02/oreilly-sarah-palin-college/
>>>>>> "O�Reilly: �Sarah Palin needs to go to college�"
>>>>>> [
>>>>>> Sarah Palin's popularity among conservatives may be strong, but
>even
>>>>>> some of them seem to think she ought to learn a little bit more.
>That
>>>>>> includes Fox News anchor Bill O'Reilly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Appearing on ABC's "Good Morning America" on Thursday, O'Reilly
>told
>>>>>> George Stephanopoulos that if Palin wants to be a serious political
>>>>>> contender for the 2012 elections, she should hit the books.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Sarah Palin needs to go to college," O'Reilly said.
>>>>>>]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> He should know, right? After all, IIRC, he passed High School
>>>>>> somehow.
>>>>>
>>>>>He graduated from Harvard.
>>>>
>>>> Amy Goodman graduated from Harvard.
>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amy_Goodman
>>>>
>>>> HTH
>>>
>>>Who cares? Obama was there, too.
>>
>> Clearly they have had a few rotten apples over the years.
>> Found herr shrubbie's transcript yet?
>
>Not at Harvard.....he went to Yale.

Where is herr shrubbie's HARVARD transcript?
He almost flunked out of Yale even with tutoring,
probable cheating, VERY simple classes & etc.

>> Anybody that helped him cheat?

Nobody seems to want to admit knowing him or doing drugs with him
or going on drinking binges with him ... or to explain why he's not
on skid row with gummer.
--
Cliff

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 4:29 am
From: Cliff

On Wed, 03 Mar 2010 15:19:44 -0500, Spehro Pefhany
<speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> wrote:

>On Wed, 3 Mar 2010 11:14:49 -0800 (PST), "Kickin' Ass and Takin'
>Names" <old_redneck@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Feb 27, 1:17�am, Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>
>>wrote:
>>> �http://rawstory.com/2010/02/oreilly-sarah-palin-college/
>>> � "O�Reilly: �Sarah Palin needs to go to college�"
>>> [
>>> Sarah Palin's popularity among conservatives may be strong, but even some of
>>> them seem to think she ought to learn a little bit more. That includes Fox News
>>> anchor Bill O'Reilly.
>>>
>>> Appearing on ABC's "Good Morning America" on Thursday, O'Reilly told George
>>> Stephanopoulos that if Palin wants to be a serious political contender for the
>>> 2012 elections, she should hit the books.
>>>
>>> "Sarah Palin needs to go to college," O'Reilly said.
>>> ]
>>>
>>> � He should know, right? After all, IIRC, he passed High School somehow.
>>>
>>> � Never happen.
>>> --
>>> Cliff
>>
>>
>>
>>Sarah Palin hitting the books would do as much good as a hog studying
>>a wrist watch.
>
>Pigs can be rather smart. I recently saw one pick out specific cards
>with numbers written on them upon verbal command.
>
>I can guarantee you that Sarah Palin wouldn't be able to duplicate
>that feat without some training.
>

A cattle prod comes to mind.
--
Cliff

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 4:30 am
From: Cliff

On Wed, 03 Mar 2010 20:13:31 -0500, Occam's Razor <blackhole@Talk-N-Dog.com>
wrote:

>On 3/3/2010 2:14 PM, Kickin' Ass and Takin' Names wrote:
>> On Feb 27, 1:17 am, Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>
>> wrote:
>>> http://rawstory.com/2010/02/oreilly-sarah-palin-college/
>>> "O�Reilly: �Sarah Palin needs to go to college�"
>>> [
>>> Sarah Palin's popularity among conservatives may be strong, but even some of
>>> them seem to think she ought to learn a little bit more. That includes Fox News
>>> anchor Bill O'Reilly.
>>>
>>> Appearing on ABC's "Good Morning America" on Thursday, O'Reilly told George
>>> Stephanopoulos that if Palin wants to be a serious political contender for the
>>> 2012 elections, she should hit the books.
>>>
>>> "Sarah Palin needs to go to college," O'Reilly said.
>>> ]
>>>
>>> He should know, right? After all, IIRC, he passed High School somehow.
>>>
>>> Never happen.
>>> --
>>> Cliff
>>
>>
>>
>> Sarah Palin hitting the books would do as much good as a hog studying
>> a wrist watch.
>>
>Someone taught you to use a keyboard so anything is possible.

You think she can read a non-digital wrist watch?
--
Cliff

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT: Guns Take Lives -- Again!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/55aad5dba11805d9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 4:54 am
From: "David R.Birch"

Beryl wrote:

> It's surely a phallic symbol thing.

Only to those without a phallus.

David

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Liberals Smarter Than Conservatives
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/30a39cd522bcf038?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 5:31 am
From: "RogerN"

"Kadaitcha Man" <anon@no.email> wrote in message
news:r065qv$310$a@unfit-street-worker.net.finland...
> "RogerN", thou grizzled confederate. You should be a woman and yet your
> beard forbids me to interpret that you are so. Ye drizzled:
>
>> That underage girls need parents permission to get an asprin at school
>> but not to get an abortion in some states. There are health risks to
>> consider, I don't remember the statistics but there are problems with
>> depression, cancer, and other health risks to women that have abortions
>> that should be considered. I heard from a doctor that doctors are
>> required to tell patients about complications and risks of all surgical
>> proceedures except abortion, the liberals have made or tried to make it
>> illegal for a doctor to inform patients of the negative consequences of
>> abortion.
>
> "I don't remember...and other [unquantified] health risks to women that
> have abortions...should be considered. I heard..."
>
> Good for you. Now, what right do you have to prevent the free will choice
> of someone else?
>
> Apart from none at all, I mean...

What right did the liberals have in making killing children a free will
choice? And what right did liberals have in preventing doctors from
informing the patient about the procedure, something the doctor is required
by law to do for other procedures?

So are you saying that anyone has the right to their free will choice? If
someone chooses to kill their child before it is born, it is OK, why not
after it is born? Maybe we should be able to kill our children anytime we
choose as long as they are dependant on us. And let's have equal rights
too, either the mother or the father can kill the child. And no one has the
right to prevent them from doing it?

"Mom, Dad, I graduated college but need to move back home for a while until
I get a job" BANG! from dads 12 gauge, just another late term abortion.

Innocent babies, liberals say "KILL THEM", convicted serial killers,
liberals say "PROTECT THEM".

RogerN

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 5:53 am
From: Kadaitcha Man

"RogerN", thou half-faced young baggage. Your peevish chastity is not
worth a breakfast in the cheapest country. Ye salivated:

> "Kadaitcha Man" <anon@no.email> wrote in message
> news:r065qv$310$a@unfit-street-worker.net.finland...
>> "RogerN", thou grizzled confederate. You should be a woman and yet your
>> beard forbids me to interpret that you are so. Ye drizzled:
>>
>>> That underage girls need parents permission to get an asprin at school
>>> but not to get an abortion in some states. There are health risks to
>>> consider, I don't remember the statistics but there are problems with
>>> depression, cancer, and other health risks to women that have
>>> abortions that should be considered. I heard from a doctor that
>>> doctors are required to tell patients about complications and risks of
>>> all surgical proceedures except abortion, the liberals have made or
>>> tried to make it illegal for a doctor to inform patients of the
>>> negative consequences of abortion.
>>
>> "I don't remember...and other [unquantified] health risks to women that
>> have abortions...should be considered. I heard..."
>>
>> Good for you. Now, what right do you have to prevent the free will
>> choice of someone else?
>>
>> Apart from none at all, I mean...
>
> What right did the liberals<BITCHSLAP>

"what right do you have..."

Note the ever so subtle difference in nuance.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Alternatives to LPS-2
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/c986024af47a68d0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 5:35 am
From: Jim Wilkins

On Mar 5, 11:26 am, Joseph Gwinn <joegw...@comcast.net> wrote:
> In article <c751ca82-3c30-469c-b11c-0339fc864...@q23g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
> Jim Wilkins <kb1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Mar 5, 9:42 am, Joseph Gwinn <joegw...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > > ...
> > > Dissolution has no effect on vapor pressure whatsoever.
> > > ...
> > > Joe Gwinn
>
> > http://www.chem.purdue.edu/gchelp/solutions/colligv.html
>
> Ideal gas law versus real substances. How big is the deviation?
>
> Joe Gwinn

Enormous, order(s) of magnitude. Consider acetylene dissolved in
acetone:
http://chestofbooks.com/crafts/metal/Welding-Practice/Dissolved-Acetylene.html
"At atmospheric pressure and 15 deg. Cent, acetone dissolves 24 times
its volume of acetylene."

jsw

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Saturday, March 6, 2010

rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 14 topics - digest

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