twitter: rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 14 topics

rec.crafts.metalworking
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking?hl=en

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Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Liberal turned Conservative
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d58ab5b914691b0c?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 2:37 pm
From: "anorton"

"Gunner Asch" <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:p7o1s5lah0cjm9i4uaqentarud1pr94qgd@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 12:07:14 -0500, "Because We Carry the Fire?"
> <southbound@down_the_road.xyz> wrote:
>
>>Liberal turned Conservative
>>The old saw goes, "A Liberal is a Conservative that hasn't been robbed
>>yet."
>>
>>Well you can see that transformation for yourself in the story posted by
>>"Robin of Berkeley" at The American Thinker.
>>
>>A self-described Liberal gets robbed and beaten, looks into the eyes of
>>evil, and turns conservative and pro-gun.
>>
>>God bless her!
>>
>>http://rue-st-michel.blogspot.com/2010/03/liberal-turned-conservative.html
>
>
> The article..direct link...
>
> http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/06/why_do_liberals_bleed.html
>
> Gunner
>

This is good. Another example of right-wing gullibility and susceptibility
to propoganda.

It is SO obvious that "Robin of Berkeley" (the author of this) is just a pen
name for the American Thinker editorial staff. How likely is it that a
former liberal (who converted just 2 years ago!), a psychotherapist, would
write 45 editorials (http://www.americanthinker.com/robin_of_berkeley/)
chuck full of every right-wing conventional stereotype of Obama and
Berkelely (the symbolic capitol of the left in the eyes of the right)? Look
at a few of the articles. They all have a different writing style.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: US lacks expertise, China to build high speed rail in California
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/80a843cd1f531f5f?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 2:46 pm
From: Gunner Asch

On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 17:14:15 -0400, Wes <clutch@lycos.com> wrote:

>Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Its interesting to know what happened the last time "chinese came to
>>America to build railroads"
>
>Some of them stayed and became Americans as did the Irish.

And many many thousands of both became part of the railroad sceanery as
they died and were buried along side the tracks.

>
>I can't remember the book but there was a part where some Chinese were prepping a rock
>face to blow it for a tunnel. Some foreman type was attempting to tell them how to set
>the charge and one of the chinese crew said, something to effect we know what we are
>doing, the chinese invented gunpowder.

They were very smart, though not well educated, but learned very fast
and became marvelous citizens.

>
>I wish I had a better memory.
>
>Wes

"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

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TOPIC: OT How the Corporations Broke Ralph Nader and America, Too.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8c40d1fcc361d00a?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 2:50 pm
From: Wes

"William Wixon" <wwixon@frontiernet.net> wrote:

>ralph nader is a great man, i hold my hand over my heart whenever i hear him
>speak. same with noam chomsky.

You can stop now William, we are convinced you are a liberal. Next thing you are going to
say is Howard Zinn is the greatest historian of all time. ;)

Wes

==============================================================================
TOPIC: ARO pneumatic chain hoist goes "up", but not "down"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/0451317c61096cfb?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 2:49 pm
From: Gunner Asch

On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 14:21:57 -0500, Ignoramus27467
<ignoramus27467@NOSPAM.27467.invalid> wrote:

>What I thought may be a great garage sale deal, looks like maybe it is
>not.
>
>I have a 2 ton (4000 lbs) ARO pneumatic chain hoist with 40 ft
>chain. When air is applied in the "up" direction, something whirls and
>howls inside and the hoist happily goes up.
>
>When I push the "down" valve on the control, the hoist kind of
>hiccups, hisses, makes quiet pumping noises inside "pt-pt-pt", and it
>either stops after a few pumping sounds or continues, but extremely
>slowly, with a lot of air coming out.
>
>Not knowing much about air hoists, I thought to ask to see if anyone
>ever repaired one.
>
>i

You have a couple bad O rings or other sorts of seals. Its not a big
deal to fix em. Might cost you $20 in seals. They are pretty simple.

Gunner

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT Responsible millionaires for higher taxes
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/ecf823165bb60d03?hl=en
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== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 2:57 pm
From: Wes

"Ed Huntress" <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:

>The data on actual tax revenues is in the IRS statistics. Census is where
>I'd go first to find out how many people are making how much money.

How did the Census find out how much I make? After answering one on how many live at my
residence, I stop filling out the form. Enumerated means counted in my book.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 3:40 pm
From: "Ed Huntress"

"Wes" <clutch@lycos.com> wrote in message
news:xu6wn.199498$rq1.122653@en-nntp-02.dc1.easynews.com...
> "Ed Huntress" <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>>The data on actual tax revenues is in the IRS statistics. Census is where
>>I'd go first to find out how many people are making how much money.
>
> How did the Census find out how much I make? After answering one on how
> many live at my
> residence, I stop filling out the form. Enumerated means counted in my
> book.
>
> Wes

Census does a lot more than count heads. Here's the personal income page. It
explains how they get income data:

http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/income/income.html

--
Ed Huntress

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 5:08 pm
From: "Buerste"

"John Husvar" <jhusvar@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:jhusvar-6F574E.09133510042010@62-183-169-81.bb.dnainternet.fi...
> In article <K-WdnXwOvJZfXCLWnZ2dnUVZ_o2dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> Ignoramus21954 <ignoramus21954@NOSPAM.21954.invalid> wrote:
>
>> http://www.marketwatch.com/story/meet-the-millionaires-who-want-to-pay-higher-
>> taxes-2010-04-09
>>
>> I certainly share their sentiment.
>>
>> Taxes should reflect expenses. Look what is happening in Greece, who
>> thought otherwise. Low taxes are a gimmick, since debts cannot grow to
>> the sky, eventually something will have to be done.
>>
>> i
>
> I vaguely remember reading an article that said if somehow the all the
> money the richest people had was redistributed evenly among the
> population of the country, the yield to each person would be
> surprisingly small. Does anybody have any clearer memory of that? Didn't
> get anywhere with Google so far.

I remember reading that if all the present wealth was redistributed evenly,
it would all be back in the hands of the original owners in a few years.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Who will be the first?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/f434d5963fd21822?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 3:00 pm
From: "dcaster@krl.org"

On Apr 10, 5:00 pm, "Ed Huntress" <huntre...@optonline.net> wrote:

> I don't think I read more than 20% of the posts on RCM. I don't read about
> CNC electronics or three-phase motors, either. That's just too close to
> production manufacturing, which I'm not interested in for hobby's sake.
>
> Ed Huntress

Three phase motors are hobby stuff now. No big thing to buy three
phase motors at $10 / hp. I have bought and sold some at about $5/
hp. The VFD's can be found pretty cheap too. So for hobby money you
can convert your machine tool to variable speed. I converted my lathe
to variable speed via a VFD and am planning on doing the same to my
drill press.

Dan

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 3:44 pm
From: "Ed Huntress"

<dcaster@krl.org> wrote in message
news:776a5786-9c88-4303-8730-2a79370ff0ba@v13g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
On Apr 10, 5:00 pm, "Ed Huntress" <huntre...@optonline.net> wrote:

>Three phase motors are hobby stuff now. No big thing to buy three
>phase motors at $10 / hp. I have bought and sold some at about $5/
>hp. The VFD's can be found pretty cheap too. So for hobby money you
>can convert your machine tool to variable speed. I converted my lathe
>to variable speed via a VFD and am planning on doing the same to my
>drill press.
>
> Dan

To me, hobby machining stops at a 10" SB lathe and a Rockwell mill.
Bridgeports and CNC lathes, etc., make up a pretty extreme hobby.

But each to his own. I'm just not interested in getting into it at that
level.

--
Ed Huntress

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 5:22 pm
From: wmbjkREMOVE@citlink.net

On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 17:00:55 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
<huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:

>
><wmbjkREMOVE@citlink.net> wrote in message
>news:h8n1s5tbnkrmosr4lkurdhohmtquje636f@4ax.com...
>> On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 12:21:05 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
>> <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>><wmbjkREMOVE@citlink.net> wrote in message
>>>news:ud31s5turihbvdcjhe64usmvpbp5ifvems@4ax.com...
>>>> On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 01:58:21 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
>>>> <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 22:02:55 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
>>>>>> <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>>>>>I appreciate someone who thinks things
>>>>>through in careful detail, Don, with an honest attempt to be objective,
>>>>>and your posts always do that.
>>>>
>>>> Remember when I wrote that your comments are sometimes too charitable?
>>>> Make that *way* too charitable. Don's posts "always" demonstrate an
>>>> honest attempt to be objective? C'mon! His own mother probably
>>>> wouldn't go that far! :-)
>>>>
>>>> Wayne
>>>
>>>I recognize that you two have a problem, but Don's always tried to be that
>>>way in conversations with me. I don't read all of his conversations.
>>
>> I'm thinking it's likely that you read in this thread where he accused
>> me of being anti-vet, something he couldn't possibly back up except
>> with more blatant falsehoods.
>
>I have to tell you, Wayne, I read quite a few of your posts but not the ones
>to or from you and Don, Gunner, etc. If I want to get involved in
>vilification, I'll write a villifying post of my own. d8-)
>
>I don't think I read more than 20% of the posts on RCM. I don't read about
>CNC electronics or three-phase motors, either. That's just too close to
>production manufacturing, which I'm not interested in for hobby's sake.
>
>> And IIRC, you responded after he made
>> some nonsense claims about B.O. Zero objectivity in both cases.
>
>Politics is politics.

I don't agree with the notion that by labeling a position "politics",
that it somehow absolves the holder of the need to reason. At least,
not if they're claiming to be reasonable. For example, when somebody
tried to tell me that Obama was sworn in on the Koran, I corrected
them. I may have been a bit disdainful. :-) First they declared that
they knew better, then that since I wasn't at the signing, their
opinion was equal to mine. Oft times it's not so clear, but generally,
there's a tendency for people with the worst opinions to flaunt them.
The blinder the partisan, the more meat on the bone. :-)

> I was referring to other specific issues we might
>discuss. I think Don slips into a more thoughtful mode when we're discussing
>something.

I'm sure he's thoughtful most times. That doesn't change the fact that
he isn't thoughtful at all sometimes, and downright cockamamie
occasionally. His preaching about "civility" while making excuses for
the cullers was an exemplary demonstration of hair-splitting. At about
the same time I'd been watching some clips of Romney dodging straight
questions about his previous support and present derision of
individual mandates. It was glorious, and I thought... Don!

>I'm hardly objective about many hot issues myself.

Good luck to anyone searching the archives for an example of that.

>> But
>> that's OK, the world needs church ladies to balance out the car
>> chases. :-)
>
><g> Thanks.
>
>> Keep this prediction in mind though: if the GOP
>> nominates Palin in 2012, Don will vote for her again. I don't know how
>> he'll rationalize it, but for damned sure it will be exactly as
>> objective as last time. And that ain't no joke.
>
>If he does that, we'll be talking about it. <g>

We might talk about, but you still won't ride him very hard. Leave it
to me. :-)

Wayne

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Battery drill external battery pack
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/2a3b10825de0128f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 3:11 pm
From: "Stormin Mormon"

I've had moments when I'm away from a power socket. But, a
short cord to battery pack would be no big concern.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Gunner Asch" <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a1q1s5p06lrmj9butne8flvrlep1gals1o@4ax.com...
On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 07:15:36 -0700 (PDT), Andrew VK3BFA
<VK3BFA@wia.org.au> wrote:

>Yep, would work - but why? - you've bypassed the
>fundamental design
>objective of a "Cordless" drill.

Well...if one has to lug a small battery pack around, versus
running
150' of extension cord across the landscape.....has it
really bypassed
the fundimental design?

Gunner

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 3:09 pm
From: "Stormin Mormon"

The advantage is for example when you're replacing an
electric socket. The next nearest one is 20 feet away, and
you're going down the hall, changing sockets. Running a cord
is a PIA, but a short cord to a battery pack is fine.

Thanks for the note on why removing a chuck.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Andrew VK3BFA" <VK3BFA@wia.org.au>
wrote in message
news:cb5bbd59-af34-4195-b487-c98e79938fd1@z3g2000yqz.googlegroups.com...

Yep, would work - but why? - you've bypassed the fundamental
design
objective of a "Cordless" drill. If you have to put up with
cables all
over the place, use a mains powered one.

Andrew VK3BFA

==============================================================================
TOPIC: fa - some high vacuum valves, and a tool holder
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/32768cb9a62772a9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 3:22 pm
From: "Bill Noble"

someone here was looking for such valves in the not too terribly distant
past, so here's the link:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300416466521

also a nice warner swasey tool holder
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300416468417

--
Bill -
www.wbnoble.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: A new "constitutional right"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8e77e80070fe5b42?hl=en
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== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 3:35 pm
From: "RD (The Sandman)"

Hawke <davesmithers@digitalpath.net> wrote in
news:hpoekg$ib3$1@speranza.aioe.org:

>
>>>> The same people who are the ones who willingly do most things
>>>> wouldn't have to be drafted as they would already be doing their
>>>> part. It's the one's hiding under their bed that you have to go&
>>>> find.
>>>
>>>
>>> That may be, but if the only people that you could have in your army
>>> are the ones who would join voluntarily, you wouldn't have a very
>>> big army. And if they could leave when they wanted to you would have
>>> a REALLY small army once the shooting started. Which is why if you
>>> want to have a big war you have to conscript people.
>>
>> We already have a volunteer army, Hawke. Have had since 1973. You
>> seem to confuse a voluntary enlistment with a simple day to day
>> commitment. That isn't how it works.
>
> You may not know it from the amount of money we spend on the military
> but we do have a very small army. If you look at how many divisions we
> have ready to fight it's small in comparison to the population. Not
> only that, we've had to relax all kinds of standards and had to
> increase all kinds of incentives to get enough people to join. Then
> you look at the people signing up and they are not the best and the
> brightest despite what you hear the military say. They are
> predominately southern and they are not well educated. So we are
> taking from the lower tier of society and we can barely get enough
> people to join no matter how much you give them. Out of 300 million
> people we can barely come up with half a million.

So we shouldn't be sending them everywhere we do.

> If you consider what our actual military needs are we don't have
> nearly enough people in the military to do what we are doing, which
> proves my point.

We should be doing less.

We have more private contractors, that is,
> mercenaries, in Iran and Afghanistan than we have actual troops.

If
> you were to consider them part of the military, and they are, we
> wouldn't have enough men to run our wars. That proves conclusively
> that our voluntary army doesn't attract enough volunteers to do what
> we want them to do so we have to suppliment them with "contractors".
> If we had enough volunteers we would have no need for them, right?

If Obama keeps going with the policies he is putting forth, we won't need
what we have.....after, isn't the Democratic oath that putting less and
less military out there is the American way and will lead to world peace?

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 3:41 pm
From: "RD (The Sandman)"

Hawke <davesmithers@digitalpath.net> wrote in news:hpodp3$gn3$1
@speranza.aioe.org:

>
>>> I doubt if Obama knows everything in that bill. It is over 2,000
pages
>>> long. Could anyone know everything that is in it? I doubt it so I
doubt
>>> he knows it all either. But what I have said once and I'll say it
>> again.
>>> I saw on the Ed Show where they were discussing the part about what
>>> happens if you don't pay the fine for not buying insurance and in the
>>> bill it specifically said there would not be any other penalty for
not
>>> paying the fine. No jail time or no further penalty. Since then I
have
>>> looked at the actual bill and tried to find that provision. I
couldn't
>>> find it.
>>
>> Because it isn't there.
>
> And you know this how? I saw the part of the bill on the Ed Show where
> the penalty part for not paying the fine was discussed. So I know it's
> in there. But how do you know it's not? Just guessing, right?

That is exactly what the talking heads are doing on most of those shows.

>> They also had the IRS Commissioner on TV saying that it would be a
>> penalty added to your income tax. Are you saying that we don't have
to
>> pay our income tax?
>
> Only what the IRS says you owe. Just like always.

The IRS has stated that they will add the fine to your taxes. Now what
happens if that fine happens to be $1200, for example, so you subtract
$1200 from your tax bill since you don't wish to pay the fine. What
happens now? You get patted on the head and told you are a good boy for
paying the rest of your taxes?

>> The most likely person not to buy healthcare is also in the 40% that
>> doesn't pay any tax. Ergo, the only hold they would have would be to
>> hold up his/her return. However, many don't even get that.
>
> That is what I heard. That they would keep you from getting your tax
> return if you didn't pay your fine. But the people who didn't earn
> enough money to get a tax return are the same people who are going to
> qualify for a subsidy for buying insurance.

A subsidy is an assist.....it isn't buying that person's healthcare for
him or her.

If you are one of them you
> obviously won't be one of the people who would be fined for not buying
> insurance.

Why not? You still owe the part not being paid for by the subsidy. Do
you think that the subsidy provides them with FREE healthcare? ;)

> So only people who can afford to buy insurance and refuse to
> do so would be fined

Wrong. See above.

and they would probably get their income tax return
> held up until they buy insurance. But I'd like to read the part of the
> actual bill that deals with this question.

It was posted in here about five or six times. Not by me, but it was
posted.

Finding that isn't easy
> though. You ought to see the table of contents. It goes on for pages
and
> pages. If you don't know what heading you're looking for good luck
> finding any particular part.

Of go to the Kaiser Family Foundation and review the bill.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Newbie worn gear questions
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/746b0b20770a9bd0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 4:19 pm
From: Wes

stans4@prolynx.com wrote:

>On Apr 6, 4:19 pm, Wes <clu...@lycos.com> wrote:
>> sta...@prolynx.com wrote:
>> >Here's a how-to book, "Gears & Gear Cutting" by Ivan Law. Covers
>> >small shop techniques.
>>
>> Ivan's book is excellent. Somehow I have misplaced it in the stacks and boxes of books
>> and periodicals I have at home. It is the one book I know I have, that I'd consider
>> purchasing again, just because I can't locate it.
>>
>> Wes
>
>Amazon, $8-9
>
>Stan

I'll just buy another copy. Maybe a few other books I can't locate will show up shortly
after. ;)

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Obama Economy
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/0c569c60c84bfd60?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 4:25 pm
From: Wes

"John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:

>> It's amazing what you can do when you steal enough money from the
>> future generations!
>
>Yeah, isn't it?
>Bush stole $6 trillion dollars and amazed the hell out of the entire world.
>"Mission Accomplisherated"
>

Bush didn't steal. The House of Representatives is where spending comes out of iirc.

Now how the bond holders got fleeced over GM, that is a true rip off.

Wes

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 5:52 pm
From: "John R. Carroll"

Wes wrote:
> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:
>
>>> It's amazing what you can do when you steal enough money from the
>>> future generations!
>>
>> Yeah, isn't it?
>> Bush stole $6 trillion dollars and amazed the hell out of the entire
>> world. "Mission Accomplisherated"
>>
>
> Bush didn't steal. The House of Representatives is where spending
> comes out of iirc.

But not on the budget Wes. A significant amount of the fresh debt came out
of the Bush White House as supplemental spending authorizations. How does
Congress defund troops in the field? As a practical matter they can't.

> Now how the bond holders got fleeced over GM, that is a true rip off.

I believe the Courts did that and those bonds wouldn't have been worth the
paper they were written on.
The appropriate value was nearly zero. What was screwed up was that the
holders of GM and Chrysler Credit Default Swaps couldn't get paid off since
they took new debt + stock. There was also a fair amount of just CDS's that
didn't pay either.

--
John R. Carroll

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 5:01 pm
From: "Buerste"

"Wes" <clutch@lycos.com> wrote in message
news:IM7wn.542490$FK3.167775@en-nntp-06.dc1.easynews.com...
> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:
>
>>> It's amazing what you can do when you steal enough money from the
>>> future generations!
>>
>>Yeah, isn't it?
>>Bush stole $6 trillion dollars and amazed the hell out of the entire
>>world.
>>"Mission Accomplisherated"
>>
>
> Bush didn't steal. The House of Representatives is where spending comes
> out of iirc.
>
> Now how the bond holders got fleeced over GM, that is a true rip off.
>
>
> Wes

No...No...No...The "But-Bush" Libtard Neo-Socialist Douchebagger crowd has
their pre-programmed mindset and will spout what their handlers at "Move-On,
Kos, and Huffington TELL them to think! Don't confuse them with facts, just
go along with what ever they say, they are as harmless as they are stupid.
Just useful idiots for their masters.

YEP!!!! ALL Bush's fault!

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 5:05 pm
From: Wes

"John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:

>Wes wrote:
>> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:
>>
>>>> It's amazing what you can do when you steal enough money from the
>>>> future generations!
>>>
>>> Yeah, isn't it?
>>> Bush stole $6 trillion dollars and amazed the hell out of the entire
>>> world. "Mission Accomplisherated"
>>>
>>
>> Bush didn't steal. The House of Representatives is where spending
>> comes out of iirc.
>
>But not on the budget Wes. A significant amount of the fresh debt came out
>of the Bush White House as supplemental spending authorizations. How does
>Congress defund troops in the field? As a practical matter they can't.

GWB can't spend a sent that Congress doesn't authorize. As to defunding the troops, that
is something few politicians want to touch. Now if they would just declare war and do it
right in the first place, we wouldn't have this sort of problem.

>
>> Now how the bond holders got fleeced over GM, that is a true rip off.
>
>I believe the Courts did that and those bonds wouldn't have been worth the
>paper they were written on.
>The appropriate value was nearly zero. What was screwed up was that the
>holders of GM and Chrysler Credit Default Swaps couldn't get paid off since
>they took new debt + stock. There was also a fair amount of just CDS's that
>didn't pay either.

The true value is zero, same as the UAW contracts. Somehow the bondholders got a hair cut
nad the union got their pay off. GM should have gone Chapter 7. I guess GM was too big
to fail.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 6:35 pm
From: "John R. Carroll"

Wes wrote:
> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:
>
>> Wes wrote:
>>> "John R. Carroll" <nunya@bidness.dev.nul> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> It's amazing what you can do when you steal enough money from the
>>>>> future generations!
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, isn't it?
>>>> Bush stole $6 trillion dollars and amazed the hell out of the
>>>> entire world. "Mission Accomplisherated"
>>>>
>>>
>>> Bush didn't steal. The House of Representatives is where spending
>>> comes out of iirc.
>>
>> But not on the budget Wes. A significant amount of the fresh debt
>> came out of the Bush White House as supplemental spending
>> authorizations. How does Congress defund troops in the field? As a
>> practical matter they can't.
>
> GWB can't spend a sent that Congress doesn't authorize. As to
> defunding the troops, that is something few politicians want to
> touch. Now if they would just declare war and do it right in the
> first place, we wouldn't have this sort of problem.
>
>>
>>> Now how the bond holders got fleeced over GM, that is a true rip
>>> off.
>>
>> I believe the Courts did that and those bonds wouldn't have been
>> worth the paper they were written on.
>> The appropriate value was nearly zero. What was screwed up was that
>> the holders of GM and Chrysler Credit Default Swaps couldn't get
>> paid off since they took new debt + stock. There was also a fair
>> amount of just CDS's that didn't pay either.
>
> The true value is zero,

Bond holders were entitled to the liquidation proceeds.

--
John R. Carroll

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT: [OT] That was funny!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/bae1b5ba237c255b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 4:42 pm
From: Wes

Winston <Winston@bigbrother.net> wrote:

>Just now I told SWMBO that I've decided to fight senility.
>
>I proudly told her that I refused to open any incoming
>package until I remembered what I had ordered.
>
>She smiled and said "Looks like the hall is going to fill up."
>
>Made me laugh out loud, that did. :)
>
>--Winston

She who laughs last laughs best. Every week day at work, I head out to recieving to see
if something I ordered for work showed up. Too darn often things show up that I can't
remember ordering by looking at who shipped it. Thankfuly after I open the box I remember
that I did order it.

Might as well admit defeat now.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

==============================================================================
TOPIC: 13' Boston Whaler Restoration
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/b1f4a854af9308a2?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 5:22 pm
From: fredfowler@verizon.net

Hey All:

A neighbor of mine on the pond I live has offered me a free use of a
13' Boston Whaler, if I can fix it up... I dinna know a lot about
those things, but free is free. It's got a couple of cracks in the
fiberglass, and gel coat, and water has seeped into the foam. Is there
a way to dry them out quickly? A quick wick? I can deal with patching
the fiberglass, but getting dry is the first step.

Any thoughts?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Fire The Failing Democrats!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/7772e35787540803?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 5:22 pm
From: Aratzio

On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 17:03:19 -0400, in the land of
alt.alien.vampire.flonk.flonk.flonk, david hillstrom <dave@meow.org>
got double secret probation for writing:

>On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 13:22:35 -0700, Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>
>>When the President was elected and this congress took office, we were
>>losing over half a million jobs a month. Now, we are gaining jobs.
>>
>>In the past year and a half, they've stabilized the banks, the
>>economy, and the major car companies, they passed health care reform
>>that adds thirty million people and cuts the deficit long term while
>>getting rid of the worst abuses of the insurance companies, extended
>>the solvency of Medicare for a decade, we're drawing down troops in
>>Iraq, we are making progress with green energy, there has not been one
>>successful terrorist attack on American soil, we've just signed a
>>nuclear arms reduction treaty and re-examined our use of nuclear
>>weapons and we are making great progress on the global stage. Hell,
>>the DOW is up over 3,000 since we got rid of the bums. Personally,
>>we're getting a road paved near me that was a disaster, and it is
>>being paid for with stimulus money. We're gonna put some people to
>>work and have a nice paved road! And Obama and company did it all
>>without getting blowjobs from interns.
>>
>>And we're going to reward them by kicking a lot of them out of office.
>>We're a really stupid country.
>>
>>http://www.balloon-juice.com/2010/04/09/down-is-up/
>
>this is NOT what i meant about fun, new threads, ratz. you get ZERO
>points.

OH, you want fun threads for just you, you selfish bastige!

Hachiroku explaining his *daddy* issues:

Message-ID: <homalb$usi$2@news.eternal-september.org>

I just keep seeing a pudgy 50 year old with his nethers rattling against
his knees...

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Apr 10 2010 5:26 pm
From: david hillstrom

On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 17:22:55 -0700, Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com>
wrote:

>On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 17:03:19 -0400, in the land of
>alt.alien.vampire.flonk.flonk.flonk, david hillstrom <dave@meow.org>
>got double secret probation for writing:
>
>>On Sat, 10 Apr 2010 13:22:35 -0700, Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>When the President was elected and this congress took office, we were
>>>losing over half a million jobs a month. Now, we are gaining jobs.
>>>
>>>In the past year and a half, they've stabilized the banks, the
>>>economy, and the major car companies, they passed health care reform
>>>that adds thirty million people and cuts the deficit long term while
>>>getting rid of the worst abuses of the insurance companies, extended
>>>the solvency of Medicare for a decade, we're drawing down troops in
>>>Iraq, we are making progress with green energy, there has not been one
>>>successful terrorist attack on American soil, we've just signed a
>>>nuclear arms reduction treaty and re-examined our use of nuclear
>>>weapons and we are making great progress on the global stage. Hell,
>>>the DOW is up over 3,000 since we got rid of the bums. Personally,
>>>we're getting a road paved near me that was a disaster, and it is
>>>being paid for with stimulus money. We're gonna put some people to
>>>work and have a nice paved road! And Obama and company did it all
>>>without getting blowjobs from interns.
>>>
>>>And we're going to reward them by kicking a lot of them out of office.
>>>We're a really stupid country.
>>>
>>>http://www.balloon-juice.com/2010/04/09/down-is-up/
>>
>>this is NOT what i meant about fun, new threads, ratz. you get ZERO
>>points.
>
>OH, you want fun threads for just you, you selfish bastige!

and everyone else. yes.

--
dave hillstrom zrbj mhm15x4

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Saturday, April 10, 2010

rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 14 topics - digest

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