twitter: rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 15 topics

rec.crafts.metalworking
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking?hl=en

rec.crafts.metalworking@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Zero Fog mister
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/22195531e109151f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 4:23 am
From: "Karl Townsend"

> A question though.........what do you use as the "coolant"? I
> presently only use flood coolant of a soluble-oil type that is a 20:1
> mix with tap water.

I use exactly the same. The fresh made goes to the CNC mill. I have a drain
tube to a pail on the table. The recycle then goes into the saw. When
running 304 SS, I up the concentration to 8 or 10% but normally 5%.

I used to use koolmist. But there's been no need for this more expensive
material.

Karl

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 6:02 am
From: Joseph Gwinn

In article <nntnr5ll2fn8railphjnm4un3v9vjuvt6a@4ax.com>,
Ned Simmons <news@nedsim.com> wrote:

> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 22:09:29 -0400, Joseph Gwinn
> <joegwinn@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> >In article <Xns9D52622595556lloydspmindspringcom@216.168.3.70>,
> > "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" <lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Joseph Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net> fired this volley in news:joegwinn-
> >> 51CB1B.09202406042010@news.giganews.com:
> >>
> >> > What application understands a .DWG file?
> >>
> >> AutoCAD, Rhino, and there are several others.
> >
> >OK.
> >
> >
> >> Besides that, you can get freeware .dwg "readers" all over. No CAD
> >> features, just display/print the file.
> >
> >Which readers by name will do this?
>
> Truview is Autodesk's free viewer -- .dwg is the native autocad file
> format. It allows you to view, print, and take measurements from a
> drawing in .dwg or .dxf format.
> <http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/pc/index?id=6703438&siteID=123112>

Thanks.

Joe Gwinn

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 6:02 am
From: Joseph Gwinn

In article <Xns9D52E8E764EB9lloydspmindspringcom@216.168.3.70>,
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" <lloydspinsidemindspring.com> wrote:

> Joseph Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net> fired this volley in news:joegwinn-
> 4D3928.22092906042010@news.giganews.com:
>
> > Which readers by name will do this?
>
> <http://www.sharewareconnection.com/redirect.php?windowopen=new&url=ftp://ftp2.infograph.com/dl/freedwgviewer.exe>
>
> This one doesn't print, but is completely free.

Thanks,

Joe

==============================================================================
TOPIC: On carbon vs. stainless steel in grills
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/6792301c4ff731b6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 4:53 am
From: Bob Villa

On Apr 7, 1:40 am, Ernie Leimkuhler <er...@stagesmith.com> wrote:
> In article <ge3nr59j81v6p2na5fsqhoqk2nm7o48...@4ax.com>, Oren
>
>
>
> <O...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
> > On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 14:08:19 -0500, Ignoramus17356
> > <ignoramus17...@NOSPAM.17356.invalid> wrote:
>
> > >On 2010-04-06, Leo Lichtman <leo.licht...@att.net> wrote:
>
> > >> "Ignoramus17356" wrote: Yes, Sir, indeed stainless is good stuff.
> > >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> > >> A rose is a rose is a rose--but stainless comes in a variety of alloys.
> > >> From your experience, some are good in the barbecue, but others may not
> > >> be.
>
> > >It looks like my barbecue is using the particular alloy that is good
> > >in barbecues.
>
> > >i
>
> > When I bought my grill, I used the "magnet test for stainless steel" *
> > The magnet did not stick to the grill grates and have not rusted in
> > the five years I've had it.
>
> > "If the magnet sticks, don't buy it."
>
> >http://bbq.about.com/od/gasgrills/a/aa052706a.htm
>
> Try walking through the IKEA kitchen section with a small magnet.
> Amazing how much of their "stainless steel" is magnetic.
> Surprised the hell out of me when I first noticed it.

Many types of SS (I believe "alloy" is a word used in "castings") are
good quality even if magnetic. It depends on the amount of chromium
used. And IIRC, the non-magnetic is nickel stainless.

bob

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 5:33 am
From: "fran...123"

"Bob Villa" <pheeh.zero@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:032e4a58-aebd-4909-82f0-28d46f9c9a30@r1g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
On Apr 7, 1:40 am, Ernie Leimkuhler <er...@stagesmith.com> wrote:
> In article <ge3nr59j81v6p2na5fsqhoqk2nm7o48...@4ax.com>, Oren
>
>
>
> <O...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
> > On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 14:08:19 -0500, Ignoramus17356
> > <ignoramus17...@NOSPAM.17356.invalid> wrote:
>
> > >On 2010-04-06, Leo Lichtman <leo.licht...@att.net> wrote:
>
> > >> "Ignoramus17356" wrote: Yes, Sir, indeed stainless is good stuff.
> > >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> > >> A rose is a rose is a rose--but stainless comes in a variety of
> > >> alloys.
> > >> From your experience, some are good in the barbecue, but others may
> > >> not
> > >> be.
>
> > >It looks like my barbecue is using the particular alloy that is good
> > >in barbecues.
>
> > >i
>
> > When I bought my grill, I used the "magnet test for stainless steel" *
> > The magnet did not stick to the grill grates and have not rusted in
> > the five years I've had it.
>
> > "If the magnet sticks, don't buy it."
>
> >http://bbq.about.com/od/gasgrills/a/aa052706a.htm
>
> Try walking through the IKEA kitchen section with a small magnet.
> Amazing how much of their "stainless steel" is magnetic.
> Surprised the hell out of me when I first noticed it.

Many types of SS (I believe "alloy" is a word used in "castings") are
good quality even if magnetic. It depends on the amount of chromium
used. And IIRC, the non-magnetic is nickel stainless.

bob

Isn't really the symmetry of the crystalline structure of the metal grains
involved in whether the stuff is magnetic or not? The hexagonal symmetry
grains being magnetic.

Fran

==============================================================================
TOPIC: #OT# Recession is over!!!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/be01c68a60161988?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 4:55 am
From: "dcaster@krl.org"

On Apr 6, 6:41 pm, Hawke <davesmith...@digitalpath.net> wrote:

> That's nice but it doesn't mean anything because the actual amount of
> money spent by philanthropists to do good is a pittance compared to what
> the government does. I'm all for people that have made lots of money
> using it to do some good. But I know the facts. Which happen to be that
> as a group the wealthy are cheapskates when it comes to giving to the
> needy. That is why the government has to do it. The amount given by the
> rich just ain't all that much. That's not my belief. That's what the
> facts say. Just like the facts say the U.S. government only gives about
> 1% of GNP in foreign aid. Everyone thinks we're so generous but as a
> percentage of what we have we're far behind other countries.
>
> Hawke

But your " Facts " are wrong. The money spent by philanthropists does
much more good per dollar than the government aid does. Bill Gates
has done more to reduce malaria in a few years than the U.S.
Government has done is the last 100 years.

Dan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Reducing diameter of straight drill bits
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/7262d560ac9bab6e?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 4:56 am
From: Ignoramus8052

On 2010-04-07, Jim Wilkins <kb1dal@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Apr 7, 1:21?am, Ignoramus17356 <ignoramus17...@NOSPAM.
> 17356.invalid> wrote:
>> ...
>>
>> I thought I could reduce a shank of that drill bit by simply chucking
>> it in a lathe and taking off some diameter with a carbide tool. What
>> are the drawbacks, if any, of doing so?
>>
>> i
>
> HSS drill bits are easy to turn smaller but then they slip more easily
> in the chuck. If you have 5C collets and a hex block or indexer you
> could mill three flats to get it into the drill chuck.

Yes, I have one, and I will do just that, great idea. I did plan on
doing that.

> 21/32" is the tap drill for 3/4-10 so I wouldn't change it enough

Exactly why I need it, to tap 3/4-10 thread.

> that it no longer fits the larger chuck.
>
> jsw

==============================================================================
TOPIC: metal working porn
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8b5bd55d05e25ae2?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 5:59 am
From: Randy

On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 20:36:43 -0700, jk <klessig@suddenlink.net> wrote:

>For those here actually interested in metal working
>
>Hot raising the skull and back of an armet from one sheet
>jk

Me thinks the link is missing.........

Thank You,
Randy

Remove 333 from email address to reply.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Jon Banquer invades VX Forum
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8c4c0e70a6085103?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 5:09 am
From: Larry Jaques

On Wed, 07 Apr 2010 00:49:04 -0700, the infamous Gunner Asch
<gunnerasch@gmail.com> scrawled the following:

>On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 17:01:04 -0700, Larry Jaques
><ljaques@diversify.invalid> wrote:

>>P.S: I'll bet you LOVED her treecat, Nimitz, especially after she
>>learned to read his feelings during one particular duel. (Crom, I
>>loved that one.)
>
>Which duel..Young and the gun, or the other guy with the sword?
><G>

Both were excellent, but Young so richly deserved it, the attempted
rapist.

>In the last 2 or 3 of the series (and its hardly done yet)...the
>treecats are taught Sign Language..and start putting their two cents
>in..and people start listening....

Cool, wot? How'd you like to wear a treecat all day?

--
Climb the mountains and get their good tidings. Nature's peace
will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees. The winds will
blow their own freshness into you, and the storms their energy,
while cares will drop away from you like the leaves of Autumn.
-- John Muir

==============================================================================
TOPIC: GOP senator likely to be indicted
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/40cb7c3aa5d1ec37?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 5:20 am
From: "Buerste"

"Gunner Asch" <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:p6cor5hfu4uata8hvbqeirf1g6mfhbdh05@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 6 Apr 2010 19:12:08 -0500, "Chief Egalitarian"
> <Egal@legal_egal.law> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Cliff" <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>>news:7dvlr5lb09faotoh4te9gorj87urc8qtud@4ax.com...
>>> http://rawstory.com/rs/2010/0405/paper-gop-senator-indicted/
>>> "Paper: GOP senator likely to be indicted"
>>> [
>>> Nevada Republican Sen. John Ensign is likely to be indicted for a
>>> $96,000
>>
>>Chimp change compared to the dollars being spent by the current
>>administration.
>
>
> Who was that black Demonrat that had a $100k in his freezer?
>
> I think he recently was convicted.
>
> And the Lefties really really outdid themselves trying to make him look
> good....<G>
>
> Gunner
>
>

Compared to the rest of Democrats, he DOES look good!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What material for grill grate
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/9468b445cbbb194d?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 5:22 am
From: "dcaster@krl.org"

On Mar 29, 5:58 pm, whit3rd <whit...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Electric stove elements have a thin layer of chrome-nickel alloy that
> stands up, in my experience, rather well. Constant showering
> of sodium chloride is ... not my cooking style. That sort of alloy,
> Kanthal or
> Inconel typical tradenames, is what was suggested.

Kanthal is actually an aluminum iron alloy. It does stand up to heat
well as long is it is in an oxidizing atmosphere. The aluminum in the
alloy forms an aluminum oxide on the surface which prevents
corrosion. It isn't an alloy I would try for a barbeque grill as the
atmoshere may somewhat reducing. That and the only form of Kanthal
that I am aware of is wire for heating elements.

Dan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Anyone have an External Hard drive available?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/4ad5b9a20cfca5fd?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 5:34 am
From: "Snag"

clare@snyder.on.ca wrote:
> On Tue, 6 Apr 2010 11:50:07 -0500, "Snag" <snag_one@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
>> clare@snyder.on.ca wrote:
>>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2010 09:16:43 -0500, "Snag" <snag_one@comcast.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> tnik wrote:
>>>>> On 4/6/2010 7:29 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>>>>>> On Apr 6, 7:16 am, "kfvorw...@gmail.com"<kfvorw...@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> My IT friend has a dongle that has multiple plugs for all types
>>>>>>> of hard drives but he got it at work and doesn't know where it
>>>>>>> came from. It was about $30.
>>>>>>> Karl
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All mine says is "Made in China". It connects PATA, SATA and
>>>>>> laptop drives to USB. It came from the second hand computer
>>>>>> store where I bought swappable IDE drive docking kits, another
>>>>>> possibility.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> jsw
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812232002
>>>>>
>>>>> Thats the one I have, and its been working just fine for over 2
>>>>> years. And at 20 bucks, you can't go wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>> One thing to remember, alot of times the front usb ports on a
>>>>> computer do not have enough 'umph' to run a hdd properly. So the
>>>>> best thing is to plug it in to the back of the computer (on the
>>>>> usb ports that are directly connected to the mobo)
>>>>
>>>> I have a Sabrent USB-DSC5 , similar to that . Came with a power
>>>> supply to plug the drives into , so power is not an issue . Also
>>>> has adapters for ANY type of removeable drive/storage unit .
>>>> http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?Item=N82E16812156017
>>> Bet it won't run single ended SCSI, differential scsi, or even most
>>> likely Serial Scsi - all of which are "standard" removeable hard
>>> drives.
>>
>> Well , ya got me there . It will handle all types of SATA and IDE
>> drives is more accurate . Had my hands on a SCSI HDD recently ,
>> didn't realize what it was until I did some research . I never
>> figured out what , if any , advantages there were to it . You seem
>> to know a bit about it , care to enlighten me ?
> SCSI (Small Computer System Interface) has a controller built into
> the drive that does a lot of data processing on-board - allowing
> faster data access - and particularly faster data transfer between
> drives, as well as faster multiple data requests. (it is a peer to
> peer data transfer protocol and can be used as well for printers,
> scanners, etc)
>
> For simple disk access SATA is getting close in speed - but in things
> like servers, with multiple simultaneous data requests, SCSI is still
> king (for a little while yet, anyway)
>
> It is an evolution of the older Shugart Associates System Interface
> (SASI)

Thank you !

--
Snag
"90 FLHTCU "Strider"
'39 WLDD "PopCycle"
BS 132/SENS/DOF

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 5:39 am
From: "Snag"

cavelamb" <""cavelamb\"@ X earthlink.net wrote:
> On 4/6/2010 9:01 PM, Greg O wrote:
>>
>> "Snag" <snag_one@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> news:KOjun.198599$Dv7.43006@newsfe17.iad...
>>>>>>
>>>
>>> www.newegg.com is your friend . I'm using a laptop drive in a case I
>>> bought for them for under 10 bucks . They also have cases for
>>> internal desktop drives , I think .
>>>
>>> --
>>> Snag
>>> I've also backed up
>>> everything on multiple
>>> computers .
>>>
>>
>> Same here, I bought a drive case for ~$15 from Buy.com and slipped a
>> spare 80 gig drive in it for back up. Also the wife had a Western
>> Digital "Book" external drive that died. I tore it apart, and it had
>> a normal HD in it. I bought a case for it too and we still use it
>> back up too.
>>
>> One other deal I picked up off Buy.com is a do-dad that will plug
>> into any HD and you can plug into the USB port and pull the info off
>> the drive. That was only $15 or so too. Saved data from a couple
>> computers with it already. I had a laptop that died, it would not
>> power up and had some info on the drive I really wanted, plus pulled
>> info off a drive a friend brought over from a crashed desktop. Well
>> worth the bucks if you have a crashed computer that you want info
>> off of! Greg
>
>
> What is the name of that do-dad, Greg?
> Or better yet, a link?
>
> I have a box full of old MFM drives...
>
>
>
> --
>
> Richard Lamb
> http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/

Check my post above , newegg stock # for a Sabrent USB-DSC5 unit was
posted . Around 20 bucks plus shipping . Mine was a gift for helping a
friend work on his motorcycle . He's the guy I call when a comp stumps me ,
since he's an IT guy for a multinat corp .

--
Snag
"90 FLHTCU "Strider"
'39 WLDD "PopCycle"
BS 132/SENS/DOF

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 8:12 am
From: wmbjkREMOVE@citlink.net

On Wed, 7 Apr 2010 06:37:08 +0000 (UTC), Curly Surmudgeon
<CurlySurmudgeon@live.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 19:58:53 -0700, Winston_Smith <not_real@bogus.net>
>wrote:
>
>> Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Looking for a 250-500 Gig USB external harddrive.
>>>
>>>I need it for backups etc etc.
>>>
>>>Yes..they are available on Ebay for $50
>>>
>>>Looking to swap for one or two.
>>>
>>>Cash..is really tight.
>>>
>>>Gunner
>>
>> There is a gizmo called a "toaster". It looks like a charging station
>> for a cell phone or PDA. It's cord goes to a USB and you shove any SATA
>> hard drive in the slot. At least some of them are hot swabable.
>>
>> Newegg just had a one hour blow out sale this morning on the Rosewill
>> version and I snagged one for $18, free shipping. But it's normally
>> only about $25.
>>
>> __
>> WS in a.s and m.s
>> Two parties, not a dimes worth of difference.
>
>Gummer should be repaying his debt, not buying electronics and tobacco.

... nor should he be whiling away his time contradicting himself, as
he's doing at M.S. by claiming to be a company owner who hires people.
He could pay thousands to a therapist to tell him what most of us
already know: he needs *less* computer hardware, not more.

Wayne

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 8:22 am
From: stans4@prolynx.com

On Apr 6, 8:30 pm, cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:
> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 11:29:58 -0700, sittingduck
>
> <d...@spamherelots.com> wrote:
> >Michael A. Terrell wrote:
>
> >> Where do you think those front panel USB ports go?
>
> >Stupid question, don't you think?
> >To a long wire that connects to some pins on usb headers.
> >They are typically weaker than the regular usb ports.
>
> The USB port supplies a maximum of 500ma per port at 5 volts. The wire
> is mabee a foot long - so total 2 feet of conductor. SAY it is 28
> guage. Resistance is 212 ohms per KM, or 0.0054359 ohms per inch 0r
> roughly 0.13 ohms for the 2 foot assembly. Voltage drop under full
> load is 0.13X.500= 0.065 volts.
>
> That's 32 milliwats of power loss.
> Totally inconsequential in my books.

If you're REALLY lucky, the MB USB ports will supply half an amp
each. The VIA chipsets aren't in compliance with the spec, NVIDIA is
marginal, the only MBs I've had good luck with USB-powered accessories
are ones with Intel chipsets and they're the ones that originated the
spec. If it's not an Intel-based MB, I get a separate USB port card
with an NEC chipset on it, hook the case USB sockets to that and
disable the MB ports. Items like the larger capacity portable USB
hard drives and port-powered scanners just can't get enough juice out
of the wimpy ports, have fought the battle many times. USB cards with
other make chipsets aren't compliant, either. Some hubs won't make
the grade, even with external wall warts. The consequences of pulling
more current than the port can supply range from the machine shutting
itself off to the port shutting off until reboot to the OS just not
recognizing the device when it's plugged in. With USB-powered hard
drives, marginal current supply will result in the drive dropping off
and adding back in repeatedly, if it happens while a file is being
moved, the file can disappear and the drive can go corrupt. If all
you use the USB ports for is the occasional flash drive and mouse and
keyboard use, you'll not have a problem.

As far as front vs. rear ports, I've noticed the same on some
machines, sometimes the front ports are the early 1.2 spec and only
the rears are 2.0. Depends on how cheap the OEM was. You'd think by
now that everyone would be putting in 2.0, at least, but there's still
1.2 devices and ports being sold on new equipment. Must be a bunch of
1.2 interface chips in some Taiwan warehouse somewhere and they need
to dump them somehow, particualrly now that v3 devices are out now.

I've also found there's a vast difference in the cables used to link
devices up to ports and hubs, too. Some have enormous voltage drops,
sometimes just swapping the cable enables the device to work. Has no
relation to price of the cable, either.

Stan

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 8:43 am
From: stans4@prolynx.com

On Apr 6, 10:50 am, "Snag" <snag_...@comcast.net> wrote:
> cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:
> > On Tue, 6 Apr 2010 09:16:43 -0500, "Snag" <snag_...@comcast.net>
> > wrote:
>
> >> tnik wrote:
> >>> On 4/6/2010 7:29 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> >>>> On Apr 6, 7:16 am, "kfvorw...@gmail.com"<kfvorw...@gmail.com>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> ...
> >>>>> My IT friend has a dongle that has multiple plugs for all types of
> >>>>> hard drives but he got it at work and doesn't know where it came
> >>>>> from. It was about $30.
> >>>>> Karl
>
> >>>> All mine says is "Made in China". It connects PATA, SATA and laptop
> >>>> drives to USB. It came from the second hand computer store where I
> >>>> bought swappable IDE drive docking kits, another possibility.
>
> >>>> jsw
>
> >>>http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812232002
>
> >>> Thats the one I have, and its been working just fine for over 2
> >>> years. And at 20 bucks, you can't go wrong.
>
> >>> One thing to remember, alot of times the front usb ports on a
> >>> computer do not have enough 'umph' to run a hdd properly. So the
> >>> best thing is to plug it in to the back of the computer (on the usb
> >>> ports that are directly connected to the mobo)
>
> >> I have a Sabrent USB-DSC5 , similar to that . Came with a power
> >> supply to plug the drives into , so power is not an issue . Also has
> >> adapters for ANY type of removeable drive/storage unit .
> >>http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?Item=N82E16812156017
> > Bet it won't run single ended SCSI, differential scsi, or even most
> > likely Serial Scsi - all of which are "standard" removeable hard
> > drives.
>
> Well , ya got me there . It will handle all types of SATA and IDE drives is
> more accurate . Had my hands on a SCSI HDD recently , didn't realize what it
> was until I did some research . I never figured out what , if any ,
> advantages there were to it . You seem to know a bit about it , care to
> enlighten me ?
>
> --
> Snag
> "90 FLHTCU "Strider"
> '39 WLDD "PopCycle"
> BS 132/SENS/DOF- Hide quoted text -
>
A lot has been pulled off the SCSI spec into SATA drives, including
the command set. Very easy to make an adapter that hooks a SATA drive
to a SCSI bus. If you go back far enough, the original PC drives had
to have CPU intervention for every read or write, this survives as the
PIO default controller mode on most MBs. SCSI by-passed this by
having a relatively cheap adapter in the machine and the smarts on the
drive. It also used DMA for transfers, so the CPU wasn't waiting
around for the drive and controller to deliver the goods. Somebody
thought this was a good idea for consumer drives, so IDE was born.
SCSI was at least 5 times the cost of a similar capacity IDE drive, so
was seldom seen in consumer-grade equipment. Still had the edge in
performance, so was used a lot in mini-computers and high-end
servers. And it wasn't limited to just hard drives, the spec allowed
virtually any peripheral to connect. It's gone through 5 or 6
iterations, each time the transfer rate improved and usually the bus
got wider. Latest is the serial-attached SCSI and there's one type
that uses fiber for data transfer. Since demand is lower for these
units, prices are a lot higher than for SATA drives. I think there
are also patent considerations, one reason SCSI hardware has always
been higher priced than IDE or SATA stuff. One of the nifty features
is that as long as the electrical interface matches, you can hook up
older stuff on newer adapters or newer stuff on older adapters. You
aren't going to get Ferrari performance out of Model Ts, but at least
the stuff works, usually. Another feature was the longer length that
the cabling could be, the differential-type interface allowed a really
long cable, necessary for large external equipment. IDE was limited
to 18" max, pretty much meant the drive had to be in the box.

I used to run a lot of SCSI drives and peripherals, the Microtek
scanner with the SCSI interface is still the fastest I've ever used.
I had 16 drives running on the one machine at one time. If I needed
more space, I could just add another to the string. Drives were cheap
on the surplus market as long as I didn't insist on having the latest
and largest. SATA dropped to the point where it was cheaper and about
the same performance, more to the point, the available drive sizes
were a lot larger for a lot less cash. So I folded the drive strings
down to 4 SATAs and an IDE boot drive. Still have a SCSI controller
in there but it doesn't get much play.

Stan

==============================================================================
TOPIC: A slo-mo crash, with little drama and no damage
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/edb3bbf007e44b25?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 6:06 am
From: Joseph Gwinn

In article <4bbc3a01$0$1601$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>,
"T.Alan Kraus" <soundadv@sonic.net> wrote:

> On 4/6/2010 7:47 PM, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
> > I was making an arbor for a Norton aluminum-oxide 4" cup grinding wheel
> > from
> > mild steel using the Clausing 5914 Lathe, and had a minor misadventure.
> >
> > The stock is a 2.5" diameter 12L14 alloy bar held in the 3-jaw chuck. The
> > part
> > I was working on is 1.000" diameter by 2" long, sticking out to the right
> > where
> > the 2.5" diameter bar has been turned down. There must have been two
> > pounds of
> > chips in the pan by then.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm making a near final pass under relatively slow power feed using
> > a
> > BXA-16N toolholder, and the flat full face of the carbide insert comes up
> > against the machined end face of the bar. Instead of machining the face a
> > little flatter, the whole BXA tool post rotates on the compound, causing
> > the bit
> > on the BXA-16N to dig a bit deeper. There were no groans or loud noises,
> > but
> > still this is not a good idea.
> >
> > Anyway, I realized what was going on, and managed to stop the show before
> > anything bad happened, leaving only an undercut as evidence.
> >
> > Another lesson on the way to becoming a machinist.
> >
> > Joe Gwinn
>
> I put a piece of ordinary notebook paper under my tool post to provide a
> bit of friction. Seems to work.

It's a thought. I've heard it suggested before, but don't know how well the
paper will stand up when soaked with soluble-oil coolant.

Joe Gwinn

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Mig Cart Photos
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/f98dd5f4bd301c30?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 6:35 am
From: Pete Snell

Hi All

Completed my MIG welder cart last night. Photos are in the dropbox
under MigCart*. <http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/>

For some reason the TXT file doesn't wrap properly, I'm not sure what
happened, so I've included it here.

"One of the guys here at work upgraded his MIG welder to one with spool
gun capablilties. He offered me his old one at a price I couldn't
refuse. It worked really well, but the leads were short, and I didn't
have a 20amp outlet for it, which limited me to the lower settings for
heat. I installed a 20amp plug near the panel in my shop, but I wanted
the ability to weld anywhere in the shop, and maybe the driveway. So I
bought 9 meters of real 12 gauge extension wire and hardwired it into
the welder. I then bought 10 feet of #2 welding cable and replaced the
short ground lead with that.

The welder worked really well, but was low to the ground, which meant
the short torch cable was bent into a sharp 'S' shape when I was working
on the bench. This made the wire feed unpredictable, and made welding
trickier. So I decided to build a cart for it, which would have the
extra bonus of giving me a spot to store the longer cables, as well as
allowing me to work at a higher position. MigCart* files show the
assembly and final product. I got to use my new JD2 tubing bender for
the side rails. It works well, but I need more practice to make my bends
where they should be!"

Pete

--
Pete Snell
Department of Physics
Royal Military College
Kingston, Ontario,
Canada
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education.

Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 7:09 am
From: Winston

On 4/7/2010 6:35 AM, Pete Snell wrote:

(...)

> So I decided to build a cart for it, which would have the
> extra bonus of giving me a spot to store the longer cables, as well as
> allowing me to work at a higher position. MigCart* files show the
> assembly and final product. I got to use my new JD2 tubing bender for
> the side rails. It works well, but I need more practice to make my bends
> where they should be!"
>
> Pete

Elegant!

http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/MigCart.txt
http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/MigCartPieces.JPG
http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/MigCartTacked.JPG
http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/MigCartComplete.JPG
http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/MigCartAssembled.JPG

--Winston

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 8:26 am
From: "Denis G."

On Apr 7, 8:35 am, Pete Snell <snel...@rmc.ca> wrote:
> Hi All
>
> Completed my MIG welder cart last night. Photos are in the dropbox
> under MigCart*. <http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/>
>
> For some reason the TXT file doesn't wrap properly, I'm not sure what
> happened, so I've included it here.
>
> "One of the guys here at work upgraded his MIG welder to one with spool
> gun capablilties. He offered me his old one at a price I couldn't
> refuse. It worked really well, but the leads were short, and I didn't
> have a 20amp outlet for it, which limited me to the lower settings for
> heat. I installed a 20amp plug near the panel in my shop, but I wanted
> the ability to weld anywhere in the shop, and maybe the driveway. So I
> bought 9 meters of real 12 gauge extension wire and hardwired it into
> the welder. I then bought 10 feet of #2 welding cable and replaced the
> short ground lead with that.
>
> The welder worked really well, but was low to the ground, which meant
> the short torch cable was bent into a sharp 'S' shape when I was working
> on the bench. This made the wire feed unpredictable, and made welding
> trickier. So I decided to build a cart for it, which would have the
> extra bonus of giving me a spot to store the longer cables, as well as
> allowing me to work at a higher position. MigCart* files show the
> assembly and final product. I got to use my new JD2 tubing bender for
> the side rails. It works well, but I need more practice to make my bends
> where they should be!"
>
> Pete
>
> --
> Pete Snell
> Department of Physics
> Royal Military College
> Kingston, Ontario,
> Canada
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education.
>
> Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

What size tubing did you use? It looks like your JD tubing bender
does a great job!
I didn't see a spot for a gas bottle? Do you exclusively use flux-
core?

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 8:58 am
From: Pete Snell

Denis G. wrote:

>
> What size tubing did you use? It looks like your JD tubing bender
> does a great job!
> I didn't see a spot for a gas bottle? Do you exclusively use flux-
> core?

The tubing is one inch diameter, 0.065" wall. The bender works great,
but it does take practice to get the bends where you want them. It only
took me 4 tries to make the 2 'rails' I needed. ;-)

The welder is set for flux core for now. I can adapt a bottle, but I
think 90% of the time I'll use this welder, I'll want the flux core. If
I need to weld something fussier I'll use my Squarewave 275 TIG. In one
of life's little ironies, I used the TIG to weld up the cart, as the MIG
machine was apart on the bench!

Pete

--
Pete Snell
Department of Physics
Royal Military College
Kingston, Ontario,
Canada
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hell is other people.

Jean-Paul Sartre (1905-1980)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Pressure washer sand blasting head
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/5f0d0504d8588064?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 7:46 am
From: F Murtz

Bob Engelhardt wrote:
> F Murtz wrote:
>> Has any one made their own sand blasting head for a pressure washer
>> instead of a commercial one? if so could you impart some of your
>> knowledge or a plan or a photo?
>
> I was interested in doing this at one time, but some research on the web
> convinced me that it wasn't worth it. I forget the details, but you
> should be able to find it. Bob
I tried looking on the web but could only find advertisements. I will
have to have another go

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Mars Direct, or getting there is half the fun.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/f278042885f73a5b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 8:09 am
From: wmbjkREMOVE@citlink.net

On Wed, 07 Apr 2010 01:43:54 -0700, pyotr filipivich
<phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:

>
>Okay, I decided to give with some URLS so that I don't have to type in
>the whole bloody book.
>
>First off, wikepedia.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Direct

> We still need that sort of national goal.

What's wrong with a national goal of eliminating poverty? Is it really
so difficult to see that a manned mission to Mars will be reminiscent
of the Soviet Union parading its fancy military hardware while its
people stood in line for bread? How much good did their pretending do
them?

Presumably you're fully stuck on the symbolism of "success". Then
consider some practical realities. Unless there's a miracle change in
attitudes and priorities, things are going to get worse overall in the
long run. A Mars mission is a lengthy undertaking, and an underfunded
effort is doomed to wither on the vine and produce a lot of stuff like
this http://www.nasawatch.com/archives/2010/03/nasa-procuremen.html in
the process. Exactly the kind of symbolism to avoid.

Wayne

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Who will be the first?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/f434d5963fd21822?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 8:22 am
From: wmbjkREMOVE@citlink.net

On Wed, 07 Apr 2010 01:25:21 -0500, Don Foreman
<dforeman@NOSPAMgoldengate.net> wrote:

>On Fri, 2 Apr 2010 17:51:26 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
><huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>>I have to agree that I'm surprised, often very surprised, to see people here
>>who I think are fine and level-headed people not objecting strongly to the
>>foulness of those character-deprived loudmouths. I can hardly stand to talk
>>to the "cullers," even those that are otherwise Ok. I just can't forget what
>>kind of attitudes are informing the things they say.
>>
>>But there's a big difference between the "cullers" themselves and the people
>>who just tolerate them. Some people here even tolerate overt racists. It's
>>just not for me.
>
>Irrelevant to the issue of cullers etc, we've exchanged discourse
>about racism and tolerance before. Tolerance is a politically correct
>buzzword that has no meaning without engagement but it plays well.
>Tolerance requires acceptance of behaviors one might find unfamiliar
>and possibly offensive, not because they harm anyone but because some
>behaviors of others that might be normal in their culture might be
>quite offensive to me. I'd say vice versa but I don't think I exhibit
>any behaviors that any of my neighbors find offensive or onerous.

You mean, other than writing reams of doubletalk making transparent
excuses for racists, deadbeats, seditionists, trolls and bald-faced
liars?

>I don't defend racism, but I do note the enigma presented by
>intolerence of intolerance, outraged judgement of perceived
>predjudice, clamor seeking a podium.

LOL Question I've asked you many times, and which you'll never
answer: Why do you have so much time to complain about only certain
types of clamor, but never about the loudest, most prolific and most
harmful clamor?

>Accusation and condemnation of racism and other prejudices is
>sometimes less a matter of reality than one of semantics and intent to
>claim higher moral ground, social competition that used to be
>influenced in smaller communities by who went to church every Sunday.

So says the king of semantics.

Wayne

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Yonnie (bunko) Bonker's bog bit the dust !!!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/f001d1a2878abc9e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Apr 7 2010 8:59 am
From: Black Dragon

Cliff wrote:

> On Tue, 6 Apr 2010 19:09:18 +0000 (UTC), Black Dragon <bd@nomail.invalid> wrote:

>>DIVE!!! DIVE!!! DIVE!!!
>>UP PERISCOPE!!!

> Down Periscope
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Down_Periscope

>>(Ooops, sorry, wrong fantasy.)

> Lauren Holly
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lauren_Holly

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uu_Md5S0frg

--
Black Dragon

Men live for three things, fast cars, fast women and fast food.

==============================================================================

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Wednesday, April 7, 2010

rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 15 topics - digest

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