rec.crafts.metalworking - 17 new messages in 3 topics - digest

rec.crafts.metalworking
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking?hl=en

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Today's topics:

* A new "constitutional right" - 15 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8e77e80070fe5b42?hl=en
* Anniversary of an amazingly enduring design - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/57c9c3facffdfb67?hl=en
* Barbecue Grill burner replacements - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/fb9fa64bdb94b52c?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: A new "constitutional right"
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/8e77e80070fe5b42?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:57 pm
From: Cliff

On Fri, 29 Jan 2010 17:37:22 -0800 (PST), "HH&C"
<hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Jan 29, 4:26�am, Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>
>wrote:
>> � Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>> � Buy your rethugs now !!!
>> --
>> Cliff
>
>Kindly list all of the republicans taht receive union backing.

Please list all stupid unions.

BTW, Try "that".

> Take
>as much white space as necessary, or even a little more.

Wait til the rethugs get their next round of bribes ...
--
Cliff

== 2 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:59 pm
From: Cliff

On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 06:06:32 -0800 (PST), "HH&C"
<hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Jan 29, 10:20 pm, "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terr...@earthlink.net>
>wrote:
>> HH&C wrote:
>>
>> > On Jan 29, 8:09 pm, grey_ghost471-newsgro...@yahoo.com (Gray Ghost)
>> > wrote:
>> > > "RD (The Sandman)" <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote innews:Xns9D0F90B1C5A5Dhopewell@216.196.97.130:
>>
>> > > > Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>> > > >news:d8a5m5h871mrcn45nrdl24qcgb78fjj8su@4ax.com:
>>
>> > > >>   Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>> > > >>   Buy your rethugs now !!!
>>
>> > > > Excuse me, but unions support the Dems and the decision was about
>> > > > corporations and the last 60 days prior to an election.
>>
>> > > Do you expect Cliff to get anything right?
>>
>> > He manages to endorse those checks that Soros sends him every week.
>>
>>    Haven't you heard of 'Direct Deposit'?
>
>Cliff has no bank account. Cliff has no address, except for a bench
>in the park. But Cliff does have a voter registration card... several
>of them, in fact.

You keep voting for lying losers & scum, eh?

Found those "WMDs" yet?
--
Cliff

== 3 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:01 pm
From: Cliff

On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 09:38:53 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

>
>HH&C wrote:
>>
>> On Jan 29, 10:20 pm, "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terr...@earthlink.net>
>> wrote:
>> > HH&C wrote:
>> >
>> > > On Jan 29, 8:09 pm, grey_ghost471-newsgro...@yahoo.com (Gray Ghost)
>> > > wrote:
>> > > > "RD (The Sandman)" <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote innews:Xns9D0F90B1C5A5Dhopewell@216.196.97.130:
>> >
>> > > > > Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>> > > > >news:d8a5m5h871mrcn45nrdl24qcgb78fjj8su@4ax.com:
>> >
>> > > > >> Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>> > > > >> Buy your rethugs now !!!
>> >
>> > > > > Excuse me, but unions support the Dems and the decision was about
>> > > > > corporations and the last 60 days prior to an election.
>> >
>> > > > Do you expect Cliff to get anything right?
>> >
>> > > He manages to endorse those checks that Soros sends him every week.
>> >
>> > Haven't you heard of 'Direct Deposit'?
>>
>> Cliff has no bank account. Cliff has no address, except for a bench
>> in the park. But Cliff does have a voter registration card... several
>> of them, in fact.
>
>
> No food stamp card?

May I borrow several of gummer's (just to see what
they look like)?
How about Palin's free (to her) socialized government medical care?
--
Cliff

== 4 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:01 pm
From: Cliff

On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 06:12:32 -0800 (PST), "HH&C"
<hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Jan 29, 8:37 pm, "HH&C" <hot-ham-and-che...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jan 29, 4:26 am, Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >   Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>> >   Buy your rethugs now !!!
>> > --
>> > Cliff
>>
>> Kindly list all of the republicans taht receive union backing.  Take
>> as much white space as necessary, or even a little more.
>
>Cliff, if you don't know what to say, just go ask Soros.

Who?
A buddy of yours?
--
Cliff

== 5 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:02 pm
From: Cliff

On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 09:25:45 -0600, No-bammer <no-bammer@fgi.net> wrote:

>Gray Ghost wrote:
>> "Fred B. Brown" <fredbbrown@nowhere.com> wrote in news:4b62e1fa$0$8447
>> $bb4e3ad8@newscene.com:
>>
>>
>>>"Cliff" <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>>>news:d8a5m5h871mrcn45nrdl24qcgb78fjj8su@4ax.com...
>>>
>>>> Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>>>> Buy your rethugs now !!!
>>>>--
>>>>Cliff
>>>
>>>WRONG!! Read the ruling and get your facts straight.
>>>"The direct political contribution prohibition in McCain-Feingold that
>>>prevents corporations, labor unions, and advocacy groups from giving money
>>>directly to candidates was not challenged in this case, thus its
>>>constitutionality was not an issue before the court."
>>>
>>>Thus corporations, labor unions still cannot give money directly to
>>>a political candidate. What was declared unconstitutional was the
>>>prohibition against these groups to advocate for or against a
>>>candidate 60 days prior to an election.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Well, he's a leftist. You didn't actually expect him to get it right, did
>> you?
>>
>
>Just like Buckwheat.

Still a flaming racist I note.
Typical winger.
--
Cliff

== 6 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:04 pm
From: Cliff

On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 15:36:33 -0600, "RogerN" <regor@midwest.net> wrote:

>
>"Cliff" <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>news:d8a5m5h871mrcn45nrdl24qcgb78fjj8su@4ax.com...
>> Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>> Buy your rethugs now !!!
>> --
>> Cliff
>
>Ha ha, 100% of the Unions supporting politicians I have seen has been that
>they ONLY support Democrat Politicians. There may be some cases where a
>union has supported a Republican, but I've never seen it.
>
>RogerN
>

Well, as the rethugs want to offshore the jobs for a quick buck ...
And their "education" stuff was an utter disaster. It will take decades
to recover from that blunder/sabotage too.
--
Cliff

== 7 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:22 pm
From: Cliff

On 18 Mar 2010 02:56:44 GMT, D Murphy <dmurf154@att.net> wrote:

>Curly Surmudgeon <CurlySurmudgeon@live.com> wrote in news:hnmes0$9c6$3
>@news.eternal-september.org:
>
>> On Sun, 31 Jan 2010 09:15:39 -0800, "Wayne" <mygarbagecan@verizon.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Unions will increasingly support democrats because of the Obama
>>> initiative to unionize all government contracts.
>>
>> What "Obama initiative to unionize all government contracts"?
>>
>
>It's called "High Road" and it hasn't been implemented yet. Far left
>fringe groups and union thugs are still writing the new regs. It's
>another racist left wing policy that will keep Unions fat and donating
>to the Corruptocrats er I mean Democrats. It has the added benefit of
>keeping minorities from traveling one of the few roads off of the modern
>day plantation, euphemistically known as "inner city neighborhoods" by
>making it harder for their small businesses to get a government
>contract.
>
>Instead of minority owned businesses getting a preference on government
>contracts, businesses paying union wages and bennies get preference.
>That makes it tough for small start up firms to compete. Which describes
>the typical minority owned government contractor, a small family owned
>business.
>
>It's a very typical Chicago Democrat policy. Just look at McCormick
>Place. It is overun with Union thugs, to the point where they have lost
>most of their biggest customers.
>
>http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/2010/01/another-trade-show-may-bolt-
>mccormick-place.html
>
>The average union worker at McCormick is male, lives in the suburbs, and
>is white. His union has mob ties and donates heavily to the Democratic
>machine.
>
>http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/ct-met-mccormick-place-fratto-
>20100312,0,6478957.story
>
>Meanwhile, minorities living in nearby neighborhoods are shut out from
>these taxpayer funded jobs and are forced to live on handouts from the
>government or from the proceeds of crime (crime provides more union jobs
>and keeps the law firm donors happy). The schools inner city minorities
>send their kids to are bad beyond belief, removing yet another avenue
>out of despair. Keep 'em poor and they'll vote Democrat. Or at the very
>least they'll wind up in the legal system which provides bundles of
>taxpayer money for police unions, lawyers, and corrupt contractors.
>
>Don't worry, you'll learn to live with it.
>
>Here's what those corrupt politics looks like on a county level -
>
>http://www.uic.edu/depts/pols/ChicagoPolitics/countyreport2009.pdf
>
>A similar report is in the works for the City itself. Obviously, that
>will take a whole lot longer to compile.
>
>And now the ones smart enough not to get caught are in the White House.

Nice of you to call Obama a racist.

Are you ever going to sell or support American-made machines?
--
Cliff

== 8 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:25 pm
From: Cliff

On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 09:12:45 -0700, Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote:

>There are many agencies who frankly..are not subject to anyone..and
>every regulation they pass becomes a mandate.
>
>An example is the California Air Resources Board.

Busted for smog, eh?
--
Cliff

== 9 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:27 pm
From: Cliff

On Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:13:18 -0500, grey_ghost471-newsgroups@yahoo.com (Gray
Ghost) wrote:

>The fuckers won't be happy until we're all standing in line hat in hand
>waiting for a government handout.

gummer is the expert.
So is Palin it seems.
--
Cliff

== 10 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:28 pm
From: Cliff

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 00:15:40 -0700, pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com>
wrote:

>a web comic I read

Now we know where you get your "facts" from.
--
Cliff

== 11 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:43 pm
From: Cliff

On Mon, 08 Feb 2010 12:27:27 -0600, "RD (The Sandman)"
<rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote:

>Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>news:0kqvm5hhvrrhbc9254nfuvptnoan0m0dng@4ax.com:
>
>> On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 11:09:30 -0600, "RD (The Sandman)"
>> <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>>news:rpqnm55ivnt4ubkk4eenboot3m256et2sg@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> On Tue, 02 Feb 2010 14:08:02 -0600, "RD (The Sandman)"
>>>> <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>>>>news:jisfm5pvoie9os1jr8q1rggls0eeb5mm4h@4ax.com:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 20:23:29 -0500, Beam Me Up Scotty
>>>>>> <Then-Destroy-Everything@Talk-n-dog.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>>>>>>> news:ecadm516nck9unkn7gosfvth1vb8bgli8g@4ax.com:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 17:16:28 -0600, "RD (The Sandman)"
>>>>>>>>> <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "RogerN" <regor@midwest.net> wrote in
>>>>>>>>>> news:0NudnbY0NcPtO_nWnZ2dnUVZ_vidnZ2d@earthlink.com:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "Cliff" <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>> message news:d8a5m5h871mrcn45nrdl24qcgb78fjj8su@4ax.com...
>>>>>>>>>>>> Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Buy your rethugs now !!!
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cliff
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Ha ha, 100% of the Unions supporting politicians I have seen
>has
>>>>>>>>>>> been that they ONLY support Democrat Politicians. There may
>be
>>>>>>>>>>> some cases where a union has supported a Republican, but I've
>>>>>>>>>>> never seen it.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Occasionally.....I saw a tidbit on the TV yesterday which
>claimed
>>>>>>>>>> that corporations were about 55-45% for Republican candidates
>and
>>>>>>>>>> unions were about 92-8% for Democrat ones.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 95% of the time the guy with the most money wins.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Does that mean we'll get laws that are actually helpful to the
>>>>>>>Capitalism that pays all the Nations bills?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When taxes on the wealthy are low we get depressions
>>>>>> & boom/bust cycles.
>>>>>> The working classes pay for it.
>>>>>
>>>>>But not the public sector.
>>>>
>>>> They provide services & pay taxes too.
>>
>> And they work too.
>
>Yep, but they essentially pay no taxes. All tax monies originated in the
>private sector.

Nope.
Earn an income, pay taxes.

Consider economic activity.
Where would you be if the governments had built no roads, as
a simple example?
What if they provided no clean drinking water?
What if they let wingers run wild?

>>>Oh? Just what do they pay those taxes with that wasn't tax money to
>>>begin with?
>>
>> Sooner or later every dollar becomes a tax dollar ... they get
>> recirculated.
>
>By paying the salaries of all public sector workers and some privatge
>sector workers. However, all that tax monies came originally from the
>private sector.

They print all that money, right? At McDonald's?

>The public sector actually pays no taxes.
>
>> Which services do you wish to do without?
>> Why?
>>
>> We could start by dumping wars
>
>That would be a start....
>
>.... and lying wingers.
>
>And these could come from both sides.
--
Cliff

== 12 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:49 pm
From: Cliff

On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 14:11:47 -0800 (PST), "HH&C"
<hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Jan 30, 4:36 pm, "RogerN" <re...@midwest.net> wrote:
>> "Cliff" <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>>
>> news:d8a5m5h871mrcn45nrdl24qcgb78fjj8su@4ax.com...
>>
>> >  Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>> >  Buy your rethugs now !!!
>> > --
>> > Cliff
>>
>> Ha ha, 100% of the Unions supporting politicians I have seen has been that
>> they ONLY support Democrat Politicians.  There may be some cases where a
>> union has supported a Republican, but I've never seen it.
>>
>> RogerN
>
>I've never seen it either. You should see their literature.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704423204575017690900226982.html
"AFL-CIO Poll Shows Union Households Boosted Brown"
[
Republican Scott Brown's victory in the Massachusetts Senate race was lifted by
strong support from union households ....
]

== 13 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:51 pm
From: Cliff

On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 15:40:46 -0800 (PST), awthrawthr <awthrawthr@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Jan 29, 9:36 pm, Chaos out of Order <goofin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jan 29, 5:28 am, "Fred B. Brown" <fredbbr...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > "Cliff" <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>>
>> >news:d8a5m5h871mrcn45nrdl24qcgb78fjj8su@4ax.com...
>>
>> > >  Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>> > >  Buy your rethugs now !!!
>> > > --
>> > > Cliff
>>
>> > WRONG!! Read the ruling and get your facts straight.
>> > "The direct political contribution prohibition in McCain-Feingold that
>> > prevents corporations, labor unions, and advocacy groups from giving money
>> > directly to candidates was not challenged in this case, thus its
>> > constitutionality was not an issue before the court."
>>
>> > Thus corporations, labor unions still cannot give money directly to
>> > a political candidate. What was declared unconstitutional was the
>> > prohibition against these groups to advocate for or against a
>> > candidate 60 days prior to an election.
>>
>> Small distinction.  Give money to politicians to use for campaigning
>> or spend the money yourself to campaign for that politician.  Yeah,
>> big difference.
>
>Unions were allowed to do that, but corporations and nonprofits
>weren't. It's called favoritism. There is no valid reason for unions
>to be able to pay for ads in the last 60 days while others were not.

Cites or more winger lies?
--
Cliff

== 14 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:52 pm
From: Cliff

On Sun, 31 Jan 2010 20:45:15 -0800 (PST), Chaos out of Order
<goofindoo@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Jan 30, 3:40 pm, awthrawthr <awthraw...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jan 29, 9:36 pm, Chaos out of Order <goofin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Jan 29, 5:28 am, "Fred B. Brown" <fredbbr...@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > "Cliff" <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>>
>> > >news:d8a5m5h871mrcn45nrdl24qcgb78fjj8su@4ax.com...
>>
>> > > >  Unlimited funding for office from unions.
>> > > >  Buy your rethugs now !!!
>> > > > --
>> > > > Cliff
>>
>> > > WRONG!! Read the ruling and get your facts straight.
>> > > "The direct political contribution prohibition in McCain-Feingold that
>> > > prevents corporations, labor unions, and advocacy groups from giving money
>> > > directly to candidates was not challenged in this case, thus its
>> > > constitutionality was not an issue before the court."
>>
>> > > Thus corporations, labor unions still cannot give money directly to
>> > > a political candidate. What was declared unconstitutional was the
>> > > prohibition against these groups to advocate for or against a
>> > > candidate 60 days prior to an election.
>>
>> > Small distinction.  Give money to politicians to use for campaigning
>> > or spend the money yourself to campaign for that politician.  Yeah,
>> > big difference.
>>
>> Unions were allowed to do that, but corporations and nonprofits
>> weren't. It's called favoritism. There is no valid reason for unions
>> to be able to pay for ads in the last 60 days while others were not.
>>
>> - Hide quoted text -
>>
>>
>>
>> > - Show quoted text -
>
>
>
>
>Agreed. Corporations and unions shouldn't be allowed to pay for ads
>in the 60 days prior to an election.

Like Faux "news" which still has not stopped?
--
Cliff

== 15 of 15 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:54 pm
From: Cliff

On Mon, 1 Feb 2010 18:10:32 -0500, WangoTango <Asgard24@mindspring.com> wrote:

>In article <Xns9D128F469A95Bhopewell@216.196.97.130>, "RD (The
>Sandman)" <rdsandman(spamlock)@comcast.net> says...
>>
>> > Agreed. Corporations and unions shouldn't be allowed to pay for ads
>> > in the 60 days prior to an election.
>> >
>>
>> Why not? Why not advocacy groups like the NRA who were denied that under
>> McCain-Feingold? The media certainly didn't have a muzzle and, yet, some
>> of them became blatant advocacy groups, particularly those under the NBC
>> label.
>
>Why do you think that Obama wants to fix the "error"?
>The muzzling of the NRA is big on the Democratic agenda.
>I guess my, or your, voice shouldn't be heard if we choose to align
>ourselves with organizations that that 'they' don't like.
>They forget that the NRA is made up entirely of people that have
>volunteered to be in it, and have done so for a specific reason.

To sell fear & thereby guns ....
--
Cliff

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Anniversary of an amazingly enduring design
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/57c9c3facffdfb67?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:09 pm
From: cavelamb

Don Foreman wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 16:32:01 -0500, Wes <clutch@lycos.com> wrote:
>
>> cavelamb <cavelamb@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>>>> And, he didn't have AutoCAD or Alibre to do his designs <VBG>
>>>>
>>>> Karl
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Neither did NASA when we went to the moon.
>>>
>>
>> I wonder how much sooner we would have got there if the engineers had a scientific
>> calculator instead of those books of logarithms?
>>
>> Wes
> That capability was available if needed. There were Frieden
> calculators, Kurta calculators, and FORTRAN became commercially
> available in 1957.

I beg to argue, Don.

Even through the late 1960s, the term "computer" referred to a
woman who operated an "adding machine". Even at NASA.

And - even I had a handy dandy slide rule. Mine is a Decilon
8 inch. I still have it and can still do (simple!) manipulations
on it.

But FORTRAN, while in the universities before late 60s, was not
widely used until much later. NASA was mainly doing "machine"
(not even Assembly!).

Heck, I know a guy who almost invented time sharing Visicalc -
but his boss though real computer time was to valuable for any
such silliness!

At least that's the way I remember it...

--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Barbecue Grill burner replacements
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/fb9fa64bdb94b52c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:09 pm
From: Gerald Miller

On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:32:21 -0600, Joe Pfeiffer
<pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> wrote:

>I'm trying to figure out why anybody would go to all this trouble for a
>gas grill... The grill in my new outdoor kitchen is charcoal, as God
>intended.
I think my neighbour has it figured right - he picked up a BBQ someone
had set out to the curb, stripped out the burners, and uses charcoal
on the rock grid. Good cast aluminium housing on a decent stand, works
great!
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

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