twitter: rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 12 topics

rec.crafts.metalworking
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking?hl=en

rec.crafts.metalworking@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Communism In The Whitehouse
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/75e583a47deaf131?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 8:33 am
From: Nixonian

The commies are redistributing the wealth of the banks!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/26/AR2010032604938.html?hpid=topnews

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TOPIC: Barbecue Grill burner replacements
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/fb9fa64bdb94b52c?hl=en
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== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 8:41 am
From: "hallerb@aol.com"

There are grill stores n many major citys.

I had a impossible to find burner, in my moms old grill which I keep
around because of sentimenta reasons, and beyond that its a very high
BTU unit with lava rock which I prefer.

I took the old burner in and they found a replacement in stock.

A burner no one else had.......

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:17 am
From: Larry Jaques

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 08:12:45 -0500, the infamous Wes
<clutch@lycos.com> scrawled the following:

>Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> wrote:
>
>>I'm trying to figure out why anybody would go to all this trouble for a
>>gas grill... The grill in my new outdoor kitchen is charcoal, as God
>>intended.
>
>Nothing tastes as good as using briquettes. I'm curious what would happen if I used some
>of the home made charcoal I made a while back with to cook a steak. Would the home made
>stuff burn cooler or hotter?

Oh, bullshit, guys. I switched over to propane 3 decades ago and
didn't notice one whit of difference--if there isn't a metal pan
between the flame and the grille. Lava rock is wonderful. I do,
however, notice a whole lot of difference in the environment around a
charcoal BBQ. Nobody can breathe downwind of one for several blocks.
I hate charcoal briquettes with a passion. They stink, they're messy
on the way in and on the way out, they take forever to get hot and
cool down, ad nauseum. Just Say No! ;)

BTW, I'm surprised that eco-terrorists (environmentalists) haven't
caused briquette companies to go out of business yet.

--
"Not always right, but never uncertain." --Heinlein
-=-=-

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 12:02 pm
From: Gunner Asch

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 10:17:22 -0700, Larry Jaques
<ljaques@diversify.invalid> wrote:

>On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 08:12:45 -0500, the infamous Wes
><clutch@lycos.com> scrawled the following:
>
>>Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> wrote:
>>
>>>I'm trying to figure out why anybody would go to all this trouble for a
>>>gas grill... The grill in my new outdoor kitchen is charcoal, as God
>>>intended.
>>
>>Nothing tastes as good as using briquettes. I'm curious what would happen if I used some
>>of the home made charcoal I made a while back with to cook a steak. Would the home made
>>stuff burn cooler or hotter?
>
>Oh, bullshit, guys. I switched over to propane 3 decades ago and
>didn't notice one whit of difference--if there isn't a metal pan
>between the flame and the grille. Lava rock is wonderful. I do,
>however, notice a whole lot of difference in the environment around a
>charcoal BBQ. Nobody can breathe downwind of one for several blocks.
>I hate charcoal briquettes with a passion. They stink, they're messy
>on the way in and on the way out, they take forever to get hot and
>cool down, ad nauseum. Just Say No! ;)
>
>BTW, I'm surprised that eco-terrorists (environmentalists) haven't
>caused briquette companies to go out of business yet.

I was the Charcoal BBQ king for decades, until the wife brought home a
new Weber propane grill..and I was devistated. I refused to cook on it!

Then she started bringing me fool she had cooked on it...and I became a
believer that propane was superior to to charcoal.

Never went back to charcoal after that.

Propane Rules!!

Gunner,

"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Women.....
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/b933f45a1ed72efa?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 7 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 8:53 am
From: Hang Dog

RogerN wrote:
> "Hang Dog" <righteous@wobble.nospam.net> wrote in message
> news:81922uFcpbU1@mid.individual.net...
>> Gunner Asch wrote:
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXzrUztyd1Y&feature=player_embedded
>>>
>>>
>> More right wing theft. Doubt they have permission to use any of the
>> photos, and definitely none of the music either. One would have thougt
>> that after McCain got caught stealing and having to pay big time, they'd
>> have learned their lesson. Chop their thieving fucking hands off its the
>> only thing they'll understand.
>
> What about the one showing better looking Democrat women and less outer
> beauty, but more inner beauty, Republican women? Do you also thing the
> Democrats that made it should have their hands cut off, or are you the
> typical leftard hypocrite?

I've not seen it but yeah if they haven't licensed the images and musics
chop their fucking hand off too.

>
> I'll bet you are against individuals making a video without permission to
> use the photo's and songs, but it's probably OK with you that you're
> President is an outright liar.
>

Quite right they should not be making videos with other peoples music
unless they've licensed to do so.

== 2 of 7 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 9:04 am
From: "RogerN"

"Hang Dog" <righteous@wobble.nospam.net> wrote in message
news:819c5tF8gbU1@mid.individual.net...
> RogerN wrote:
>> "Hang Dog" <righteous@wobble.nospam.net> wrote in message
>> news:81922uFcpbU1@mid.individual.net...
>>> Gunner Asch wrote:
>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXzrUztyd1Y&feature=player_embedded
>>>>
>>>>
>>> More right wing theft. Doubt they have permission to use any of the
>>> photos, and definitely none of the music either. One would have thougt
>>> that after McCain got caught stealing and having to pay big time, they'd
>>> have learned their lesson. Chop their thieving fucking hands off its the
>>> only thing they'll understand.
>>
>> What about the one showing better looking Democrat women and less outer
>> beauty, but more inner beauty, Republican women? Do you also thing the
>> Democrats that made it should have their hands cut off, or are you the
>> typical leftard hypocrite?
>
>
> I've not seen it but yeah if they haven't licensed the images and musics
> chop their fucking hand off too.
>
>
>>
>> I'll bet you are against individuals making a video without permission to
>> use the photo's and songs, but it's probably OK with you that you're
>> President is an outright liar.
>>
>
> Quite right they should not be making videos with other peoples music
> unless they've licensed to do so.

Here's one you should enjoy then, simply a music video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdKmc9aBELM

RogerN

== 3 of 7 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 9:46 am
From: Hang Dog

RogerN wrote:
>
> Here's one you should enjoy then, simply a music video.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdKmc9aBELM
>

Well done, though I'm pretty sure the tune has been nicked from
someplace else. In any case why do you think I'd be interested in any of
your whining bitch boy parochial nonsense any way?

== 4 of 7 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:18 am
From: "RogerN"

"Hang Dog" <righteous@wobble.nospam.net> wrote in message
news:819f8pFsjgU1@mid.individual.net...
> RogerN wrote:
>>
>> Here's one you should enjoy then, simply a music video.
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdKmc9aBELM
>>
>
> Well done, though I'm pretty sure the tune has been nicked from someplace
> else. In any case why do you think I'd be interested in any of your
> whining bitch boy parochial nonsense any way?

What Obama lie are you referring to? There are so many...

RogerN

== 5 of 7 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:12 am
From: Gunner Asch

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 14:01:25 +0100, Hang Dog
<righteous@wobble.nospam.net> wrote:

>Gunner Asch wrote:
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXzrUztyd1Y&feature=player_embedded
>>
>>
>
>More right wing theft. Doubt they have permission to use any of the
>photos, and definitely none of the music either. One would have thougt
>that after McCain got caught stealing and having to pay big time, they'd
>have learned their lesson. Chop their thieving fucking hands off its the
>only thing they'll understand.

Odd...according to you Marxists..there is no such thing as private
property.

So it appears that the video is effective if it causes you buffoons to
go out and start bitching about private property rights.

To the authors..Very well done!

Gunner

== 6 of 7 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:13 am
From: Gunner Asch

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 16:53:41 +0100, Hang Dog
<righteous@wobble.nospam.net> wrote:

>RogerN wrote:
>> "Hang Dog" <righteous@wobble.nospam.net> wrote in message
>> news:81922uFcpbU1@mid.individual.net...
>>> Gunner Asch wrote:
>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXzrUztyd1Y&feature=player_embedded
>>>>
>>>>
>>> More right wing theft. Doubt they have permission to use any of the
>>> photos, and definitely none of the music either. One would have thougt
>>> that after McCain got caught stealing and having to pay big time, they'd
>>> have learned their lesson. Chop their thieving fucking hands off its the
>>> only thing they'll understand.
>>
>> What about the one showing better looking Democrat women and less outer
>> beauty, but more inner beauty, Republican women? Do you also thing the
>> Democrats that made it should have their hands cut off, or are you the
>> typical leftard hypocrite?
>
>
>I've not seen it but yeah if they haven't licensed the images and musics
>chop their fucking hand off too.
>
>
>>
>> I'll bet you are against individuals making a video without permission to
>> use the photo's and songs, but it's probably OK with you that you're
>> President is an outright liar.
>>
>
>Quite right they should not be making videos with other peoples music
>unless they've licensed to do so.

One simply cannot pass the fact that the Dog ignored the question can
one?

Laugh laugh laugh

Gunner

== 7 of 7 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:50 am
From: Gunner Asch

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 17:46:25 +0100, Hang Dog
<righteous@wobble.nospam.net> wrote:

>RogerN wrote:
>>
>> Here's one you should enjoy then, simply a music video.
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdKmc9aBELM
>>
>
>Well done, though I'm pretty sure the tune has been nicked from
>someplace else. In any case why do you think I'd be interested in any of
>your whining bitch boy parochial nonsense any way?

Cause your a whiny cunt.

Gunner

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

==============================================================================
TOPIC: What material for grill grate
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/9468b445cbbb194d?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 9:51 am
From: "Steve W."

dcaster@krl.org wrote:
> On Mar 27, 6:44 pm, Ignoramus11443 <ignoramus11...@NOSPAM.
> 11443.invalid> wrote:
>> We have a "stainless steel grill" from Sam's club. While the outside
>> is stainless, the burners, as well as the lower grate, are not, and
>> have almost completely rotted.
>>
>
>> I thought to just buy some thicker steel, or stainless, rod and weld
>> it together. The question is what is the recommended material.
>>
>> i
>
> It just depends on how much you want to pay and how long you want it
> to last. 309 and 310 are the stainless steels recommended for high
> temperatures. But they are really expensive. 316 will last better
> than 304 and 304 will do better than rebar. If it were me, I would
> probably use some rebar that is thinker than the original. Maybe put
> some kiln wash or ceramic enamel on it to slow up the rusting.
>
>
> Dan

Having owned MANY grills from the cheap one up through the top of the
line ones. There is not a stainless easily available that will take the
heat and not rot.

I would replace the burners with cast iron ones. You may not find ones
exactly like what you have. BUT you could buy ones that are wider and
cut them down easily enough.

For the grid I would find some iron grating and use it. You can get
enameled iron grills for Webers. Or if you visit a fireplace store you
will find the cast iron grates used in stoves and furnaces that burn
wood/coal. Those could easily be cut to fit your grill.

--
Steve W.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Reading RCM via Mac?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/903342897565e9ff?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:07 am
From: joel

In article <slrnhqtnu0.rov.dnichols@Katana.d-and-d.com>,
"DoN. Nichols" <dnichols@d-and-d.com> wrote:

> On 2010-03-25, steamer <steamer@sonic.net> wrote:
> > --A pal of mine was wondering what other Mac users prefer for
> > reading usenet. I'm on the PC side of the fence using putty and haven't a
> > clue what's on the Mac side.
> > Suggestions welcome and I'll pass 'em along to my pal
>
> Well ... I haven't done newsreading on my Mac, but if I were to
> do so, I would probably download this:
>
> <http://slrn.darwinports.com/>
>
> so I could continue using slrn as my newsreader.
>
> I don't know whether it supports a GUI interface on the Mac, but
> I do know that it works nicely in a plain text screen, which is what I
> prefer under a newsreader.
>
> It also lets you configure which editor to use -- and I normally
> use jove on my other unix systems, but if I did not have it downloaded
> for the Mac (I do have it) I would probably pick emacs as the editor. I
> know that one is supplied with the extras with Mac OS-X.
>
> Enjoy,
> DoN.

I highly recommend MT-newswatcher. Very good newsreader, very flexible,
but easy to use. http://ww.smfr.org/mtnw

--Joel

--
remove "xxxnospamxxx" to reach me

==============================================================================
TOPIC: An open letter to conservatives
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/9be56917d888f492?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:08 am
From: sittingduck

Garlicdude wrote:

> And then I stopped. That's because the last thing I need in my life
> right now is some self-satisfied, sanctimonious fuck of a liberal
> telling what I need to be doing right now. And based on the above,
> that's exactly what you are: A self-satisfied, sanctimonious liberal
> fuck" ........................

This "conservative" should have read the whole thing, but instead reacts in a
typical way, hurling names and cursing.

Sad. And predictable.

--
Rationality belongs to the cool observer, but because of the stupidity of the
average man, he follows not reason but faith - Reinhold Niebuhr

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:12 am
From: "PrecisionmachinisT"

"Garlicdude" <pulsar@garlic.com> wrote in message
news:0oednYpl__Ab_zLWnZ2dnUVZ_vydnZ2d@posted.southvalleyinternet...
> sittingduck wrote:
> > An open letter to conservatives
> > March 22, 2010, 3:16PM
> > http://tinyurl.com/yc55hxj
> > VERY WELL REFERENCED, read at TPM for more info.
> >
> > Dear Conservative Americans,
> >
> > The years have not been kind to you. I grew up in a profoundly
Republican
> > home,
> > so I can remember when you wore a very different face than the one we
see
> > now.
> > You've lost me and you've lost most of America. Because I believe having
> > responsible choices is important to democracy, I'd like to give you some
> > advice
> > and an invitation.
> >
> > First, the invitation: Come back to us.
>
>
>
> "Dear Russell King:
>
> I read your open letter over at Talking Point Memo and felt it worthy of a
> response...
>
> Actually that's not true, I read this much of your letter:
>
> Dear Conservative Americans,
>
> The years have not been kind to you. I grew up in a profoundly
Republican
> home, so I can remember when you wore a very different face than the one
we see
> now. You've lost me and you've lost most of America. Because I believe
having
> responsible choices is important to democracy, I'd like to give you some
advice
> and an invitation.
>
> First, the invitation: Come back to us.
>
> Now the advice. You're going to have to come up with a platform that
isn't
> built on a foundation of cowardice: fear of people with colors, religions,
> cultures and sex lives that differ from your own; fear of reform in
banking,
> health care, energy; fantasy fears of America being transformed into an
Islamic
> nation, into social/commun/fasc-ism, into a disarmed populace put in
internment
> camps; and more. But you have work to do even before you take on that
task.
>
> And then I stopped. That's because the last thing I need in my life right
now is
> some self-satisfied, sanctimonious fuck of a liberal telling what I need
to be
> doing right now. And based on the above, that's exactly what you are: A
> self-satisfied, sanctimonious liberal fuck" ........................
>

Then there's the self-satisfied, sanctimonious conservative fucks--when they
can't seem to conjure up anything at all which would counter a detractor's
claims they angrily launch into a childish tirade instead, calling folks
"liberals" as though it were some sort of invective, maybe toss in a few
choice swear words for good measure....

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:16 am
From: Gunner Asch

On Sun, 28 Mar 2010 09:12:33 -0800, "PrecisionmachinisT"
<precisionmachinist@notmail.com> wrote:

>
>"Garlicdude" <pulsar@garlic.com> wrote in message
>news:0oednYpl__Ab_zLWnZ2dnUVZ_vydnZ2d@posted.southvalleyinternet...
>> sittingduck wrote:
>> > An open letter to conservatives
>> > March 22, 2010, 3:16PM
>> > http://tinyurl.com/yc55hxj
>> > VERY WELL REFERENCED, read at TPM for more info.
>> >
>> > Dear Conservative Americans,
>> >
>> > The years have not been kind to you. I grew up in a profoundly
>Republican
>> > home,
>> > so I can remember when you wore a very different face than the one we
>see
>> > now.
>> > You've lost me and you've lost most of America. Because I believe having
>> > responsible choices is important to democracy, I'd like to give you some
>> > advice
>> > and an invitation.
>> >
>> > First, the invitation: Come back to us.
>>
>>
>>
>> "Dear Russell King:
>>
>> I read your open letter over at Talking Point Memo and felt it worthy of a
>> response...
>>
>> Actually that's not true, I read this much of your letter:
>>
>> Dear Conservative Americans,
>>
>> The years have not been kind to you. I grew up in a profoundly
>Republican
>> home, so I can remember when you wore a very different face than the one
>we see
>> now. You've lost me and you've lost most of America. Because I believe
>having
>> responsible choices is important to democracy, I'd like to give you some
>advice
>> and an invitation.
>>
>> First, the invitation: Come back to us.
>>
>> Now the advice. You're going to have to come up with a platform that
>isn't
>> built on a foundation of cowardice: fear of people with colors, religions,
>> cultures and sex lives that differ from your own; fear of reform in
>banking,
>> health care, energy; fantasy fears of America being transformed into an
>Islamic
>> nation, into social/commun/fasc-ism, into a disarmed populace put in
>internment
>> camps; and more. But you have work to do even before you take on that
>task.
>>
>> And then I stopped. That's because the last thing I need in my life right
>now is
>> some self-satisfied, sanctimonious fuck of a liberal telling what I need
>to be
>> doing right now. And based on the above, that's exactly what you are: A
>> self-satisfied, sanctimonious liberal fuck" ........................
>>
>
>Then there's the self-satisfied, sanctimonious conservative fucks--when they
>can't seem to conjure up anything at all which would counter a detractor's
>claims they angrily launch into a childish tirade instead, calling folks
>"liberals" as though it were some sort of invective, maybe toss in a few
>choice swear words for good measure....

You mean Liberals arent bad people, moderately mentally ill?

Denial is not a river in Egypt.

Gunner

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Millrite cuts in one direction only
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/fa5c0f160bbad90b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:22 am
From: Joseph Gwinn

Another chapter in the unfolding saga of my education as a machine tool tech.

While using the Millrite MVI to mill the ends of mild steel bars off square, I
noticed something odd. When moving the table in and out in the Y direction
(closer and farther from the column) with the table clamped in the X-axis
direction, cutting would happen only in the conventional-milling direction, and
no cutting would happen in the climb-milling direction, unless I moved the table
in the X-direction (side-to-side).

The bar is held in a milling vise, the bar being parallel to the T-slots in the
table, with the left end being presented to the side of the cutter (6 helical
flutes, 1" in diameter).

As I'm cranking the table in and out I'm wondering what could cause that.
Clearly, there is some unintended X-axis motion due to the intended Y-axis
motion, despite the X-axis being clamped. So, I used the Skoal optical
centering scope <http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=240-0404> to test the
theory, finding that reversing Y-axis direction causes a ~0.0028" X-axis motion.
That's a lot, and certainly explains why the mill would cut only in one
direction, and also why I had some difficulty cutting the bars to a specified
length.

Cause? The Y-axis feedscrew is on the right side of the saddle, so if the
saddle-to-knee gib is loose the saddle will cock one way when being cranked
closer to the column and will cock the other way when being cranked away from
the column. So, time to adjust the saddle-knee gib. This was easily done, and
eliminated the X-axis motion due to Y-axis motion. I wonder when that gib was
last tightened.

What I have not yet done is to tighten the table-saddle (X-axis) gib, as this
requires removal of the table-saddle assembly from the mill to get access to the
adjustment screws and setscrews. Given the difficulty, I bet this gib has never
been adjusted. The X-axis feedscrew is in the center, so cocking would be more
random and thus more confusing than in the Y-axis. Table removal isn't
difficult, but requires a small hoist. I don't have the space to store such a
hoist, but they can be rented from the local Taylor Rentals place.

Or, I can hang the table from the ram with welded-link chain and quick links
<http://www.cvfsupply.com/hardware/516_quick_link_chain_repair_links.html> and
eyebolts bolted to the table, undo and remove the saddle-knee gib, and crank the
knee down leaving the table-saddle assembly dangling from the ram. Perhaps I
can then tighten the table-saddle gib on the dangling assembly. I'll have to
work out the details of how this would be done safely. And the Y-axis DRO will
have to be removed. I already have the eyebolts and matching thick washers and
T-nuts, bought precisely to allow secure attachment for safe lifting of the
table.

Joe Gwinn

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Anniversary of an amazingly enduring design
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/57c9c3facffdfb67?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:31 am
From: Eregon

Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in
news:bj5uq5lue3mj8b8gb6hnutuu0vj9emugkk@4ax.com:

>
>
> High capacity? How many people do you figure are going to be attacking
> you at one time? If its more than 3..doncha think a rifle would be a
> better tool?
>

Personally, I prefer a shotgun with 00 buck for the shorter ranges if
there's to be a crowd. <grin>

The old Ithaca 37 definitely has its advantages, especially with the
extended mag tube...

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:04 am
From: "Ed Huntress"

"John" <johnbslocomb@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:tq3uq5tltc1fuciq7rbce6gu92vklebe3i@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 11:19:06 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
> <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Ignoramus11443" <ignoramus11443@NOSPAM.11443.invalid> wrote in message
>>news:vMCdnWWkoaaMhzPWnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>>> That's a very enduring design, yes. I actually own a Beretta and love
>>> it. How does that .45 handle, is the recoil a little too much?
>>>
>>> i
>>
>>The recoil is completely undramatic. With service loads, it's a little
>>slower to get back on target than a full-size nine, but it doesn't feel
>>heavy to me. I'm been shooting them for just under 40 years and they
>>remain
>>my favorite target pistol.
>
>
> With hardball ammunition?
>
> John B.

I shoot my .45 with hardball, and with semi-wadcutters and light loads. I
don't feel anything qualitatively different with the hardball.

I always thought it was me. I'm fairly light; I may just roll with it better
than some. My 3-1/2" magnum shotgun leaves me black and blue, and hurting,
but I can shoot a .44 magnum handgun with full loads and not suffer from it
a bit. It's kind of odd.

--
Ed Huntress

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:53 am
From: Gunner Asch

On 28 Mar 2010 17:31:32 GMT, Eregon <Eragon@Saphira.org> wrote:

>Gunner Asch <gunnerasch@gmail.com> wrote in
>news:bj5uq5lue3mj8b8gb6hnutuu0vj9emugkk@4ax.com:
>
>>
>>
>> High capacity? How many people do you figure are going to be attacking
>> you at one time? If its more than 3..doncha think a rifle would be a
>> better tool?
>>
>
>Personally, I prefer a shotgun with 00 buck for the shorter ranges if
>there's to be a crowd. <grin>
>
>The old Ithaca 37 definitely has its advantages, especially with the
>extended mag tube...

<VBG>...oh indeed...yes indeed!!

Gunner

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

==============================================================================
TOPIC: DIY surge protection...
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/fa560b93f2504a9b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:40 am
From: bud--

Doug White wrote:
>
> So, I'm back to finding a good unit to attach to the breaker panel. It's
> too bad, because the earth ground has a more direct connection to the
> meter box than to the breaker panel.

Earthing electrodes are connected to the neutral in the meter enclosure?
Not the most common practice. (If that is the connection, it removes one
of my comments on the suppressor at the meter.)

The breaker panel, I assume, has the service disconnect. That means the
neutral and ground are bonded together at that point and it is the
'ground reference point' for the power system. The phone and cable entry
protectors should be connected to the earthing electrode wire that
connects to the meter. You want the length of the ground wire from
phone/cable entry protectors to the common connection with the power
system earthing to be short. You also want the distance from that common
connection point to the power ground reference point (in the service
panel) to be short. Yours is lengthened by the length of neutral from
the panel to the meter. If there is a large surge current from power
wires to earth, that raises the voltage between power and phone/cable
wires. If that is a concern, there are some service panel suppressors
that have ports for phone and cable wires to go through (SquareD makes one).

--
bud--

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:56 am
From: Ecnerwal

In article <a2f69$4baf9510$cde8d528$17452@DIALUPUSA.NET>,
bud-- <remove.budnews@isp.com> wrote:

> Doug White wrote:
> >
> > So, I'm back to finding a good unit to attach to the breaker panel. It's
> > too bad, because the earth ground has a more direct connection to the
> > meter box than to the breaker panel.
>
> Earthing electrodes are connected to the neutral in the meter enclosure?
> Not the most common practice. (If that is the connection, it removes one
> of my comments on the suppressor at the meter.)

It depends on the utility. Either is acceptable to the NEC, and the
distance between the meter and the service panel should be short.

Delta Lighting Arrestors are one common brand, trivial to install.

http://www.deltala.com/

You can have both an arrestor and a capacitor if you like. Look for
LA302R and CA302R if searching the web. The surge capacitor helps the
surge arrestor, at some additional cost. They also make
larger/industrial units, though doubling up residential units seems to
get more bang for the buck than swapping a "residential" for an
"industrial", at least at the 120/240 single-phase service point.
Keeping the leads as short as possible when installing them on the panel
will help them work better.

Several of the panel makers (eg, Square D) have come up with in-panel
units that plug in like a dual pole breaker, but they cost more. In
theory, they might work better due to less lead inductance as they are
plugged right into the bus bars. In practice, they have lower ratings
than Delta arrestors available for half the price, probably because they
have to fit into the space alloted to two breakers.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by

==============================================================================
TOPIC: If George Bush........
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/ee503716cb3ad0d5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:55 am
From: "Ed Huntress"

"Hawke" <davesmithers@digitalpath.net> wrote in message
news:homhun$tgg$1@speranza.aioe.org...
>
>>> Total US taxes, the total tax divided by the number of citizens, has
>>> ranged
>>> between the lowest and third-lowest among developed countries (the OECD
>>> countries) in recent years. Our corporate tax, which was the lowest
>>> among
>>> that group until not many years ago, is now nominally one of the highest
>>> because those other countries have been in a race to keep companies from
>>> leaving their countries and moving elsewhere -- like big pharma did when
>>> much of it moved to the US. But in practice, because of all of the
>>> complexities in our tax code, our corporations pay less tax than those
>>> in
>>> any other developed country. Our real average corporate tax is around
>>> 19%
>>> of
>>> their profits.
>>>
>>> The total tax burden is another issue, but one thing is absolutely clear
>>> from the numbers: The US is not at a competitive disadvantage because of
>>> our
>>> total tax rates. And corporations are paying much less in fact, even
>>> though
>>> our *nominal* rates are higher, than their competitors in other
>>> developed
>>> countries.
>>>
>>> The big "tax" disadvantage our larger corporations suffer from is paying
>>> healthcare and pensions, much of which are picked up by the state in
>>> other
>>> countries. That's why they have higher *overall* tax rates, in terms of
>>> total taxes per individual. Corporations get off that hook in many other
>>> countries. The taxes are still there, but they're shifted off the
>>> corporations' backs and onto individual citizens.
>>>
>>> There are other, smaller examples that explain why taxes are so high in
>>> other countries, even while we yell about taxes here. Our system is
>>> skewed
>>> in some ways that hurt performance (like our health care system) while
>>> turning the screws in some places but not in others. But flat taxes and
>>> VATs
>>> don't, in themselves, help to straighten out the matters of performance
>>> of
>>> social institutions or corporate competitiveness. If you flattened out
>>> the
>>> taxes without introducing a universal health care system, you'd just put
>>> the
>>> squeeze on the middle class, particularly the lower-middle. And VATs are
>>> steeply regressive. European countries use a very steeply progressive
>>> income
>>> tax -- the opposite of a flat income tax -- to compensate. You *would*
>>> succeed in depressing consumption with a VAT in the US, but then you'd
>>> be
>>> forced, like Germany and Japan, to depend excessively on a mercantilist
>>> (export-based) economy. You can see where it's gotten them: in a
>>> downturn,
>>> they're sucking wind from all directions. Not only do they feel the
>>> recession more sharply than we do, but they can't do a damned thing
>>> about
>>> it
>>> until the economies of their trading partners pick up.
>>>
>>> All in all, it wouldn't be healthy for us to have a flat tax and/or a
>>> VAT.
>>> We be in a real race to the bottom against China, SE Asia, and a few
>>> others.
>>> Our economy really does rely on high rates of domestic consumption, and,
>>> most of the time, it leaves us in a stronger position overall. That's
>>> why
>>> our Treasury bills still sell to foreigners. They've lost some of their
>>> glitter lately but you would expect, all else being equal, that they
>>> would
>>> have completely tanked.
>>>
>>> All else isn't equal because we can recover from a recession better than
>>> most. And our tax system is part of the reason. Tinker with it at your
>>> peril.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> John R. Carroll
>>
>> Is there an echo in here? d8-)
>>
>
> I'm not hearing one.
> But I thought I would be hearing a lot of carping and arguing about what
> JC just said. Because whenever anyone tells the truth about our country
> the right wing boys come out of the woodwork to argue against it. So I'm
> expecting a barrage against what he said any minute now. Probably led by
> the Goober, who knows nothing about what was said.
>
> Hawke

This is a bit of a joke. John cut and pasted one of my old messages. I'm
curious to see if it gets a different reaction when his name is on it. d8-)

--
Ed Huntress

==============================================================================
TOPIC: OT -- off grid power systems
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/284c9711ef5c39e6?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 10:57 am
From: nobody@nowhere.org

On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 08:32:32 -0500, spaco <spaco@baldwin-telecom.net>
wrote:

>Your request doesn't seem to be an "off grid" request, but here's my reply.
>
>a.s.photovoltaic is one newsgroup that deals with things solar-PV. You
>have to put up with some guys who like to beat eachother up, but if you
>persist, you can learn some things.
>
>I have two friends within 50 miles of me who have put up 3Kw and 7Kw pv
>systems recently.
> They are both grid tied. One cost about $40,000 and the other cost
>about $70,000. Rebates pay about 1/2 of that back in Wisconsin.
> They both supply their local load and do grid tie, but if the power
>goes away, neither of them generate for local use.
> You have to spend more money to get that feature, I am told.
>Also, neither one of them went with batteries. We have a pretty
>reliable grid here.
>
>Pete Stanaitis

That sounds similar to the www.sunergy.com systems sold here in the
PNW. I called them wanting a system that feeds back into the grid if
there's an excess *and* also provide us power if the grid goes down.
No can do, she said.

If your friends systems are capable of this, I'd really appreciate the
contact info of that company.

Thanks Pete,

Newb

>---------------------------------
>
>David Lesher wrote:
>
>> I'd like to chat offline with someone who has installed a solar
>> array system that feeds your load AND backfeeds to the grid
>> {"meter backwards"}.
>>
>> And/or, I'm looking for a pointer to forums [formi??] centered
>> around such.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Why do razor blades get dull so fast?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d0ab1ef54b638ce4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 28 2010 11:36 am
From: Winston

On 3/28/2010 5:40 AM, mike wrote:

(...)

> One thing that I noticed to give me several months out of each
> disposable blade
> cartridge, was leaving the shaving lather to sit in place for a couple
> minutes before
> taking razor to it -

Yup! I lather up and walk down the hall to boot up the computer.
Returning to the bathroom, I'm ready for a close, nick - free shave.
If I just start shaving, I can scratch myself up pretty good.

(...)

> Also, rinse the razor in COLD water after every couple
> strokes, saw that
> in a movie once 8^).

As a yout, I was getting only 2-3 shaves per Trac II cartridge even
with aggressive rinsing. I ran a lot of water down the vents in
the back of the cartridge, too. On inspection, I found that the 'vents'
were completely blind and without function. I also found
that the cartridge was loading up very quickly; the clogged shavings were
holding the blade off my skin! I now clean my razor in an ultrasonic
bath every day and average > 7 shaves per blade.

I was starting to panic when running low on my favorite 'unobtanium'
Trac II cartridges until I stumbled across American Safety Razor Personna
_TwinII Plus_ cartridges for cheap on eBay. (See item 350333133296)

They work just as good as the old name brand blades.

U$0.45 each, (delivered) and Made In U.S.A.!

--Winston

--
Today's retailer is in an awkward position.
He must assuage his visceral need to anger
some of his clients while having to delight
them sufficiently to guarantee repeat business.

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Sunday, March 28, 2010

rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 12 topics - digest

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