twitter: rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 15 topics

rec.crafts.metalworking
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Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Wingers keep lying !!!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/3e88a3bd89afa214?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 3:58 pm
From: Cliff

On Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:54:37 -0400, Beam Me Up Scotty
<Then-Fire-A-Full-Spred-Of-Photon-Torpedoes@blackhole.NebulaX.com> wrote:

>On 3/21/2010 5:45 AM, Cliff wrote:
>> On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 16:35:42 -0400, Beam Me Up Scotty
>> <Then-Fire-A-Full-Spred-Of-Photon-Torpedoes@blackhole.NebulaX.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 3/20/2010 2:32 PM, Cliff wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 12:36:32 -0400, Beam Me Up Scotty
>>>> <Then-Fire-A-Full-Spred-Of-Photon-Torpedoes@blackhole.NebulaX.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> You are launched through the windshield because you were wearing no seat
>>>>> belt, it happens because you chose to wear or not wear the things that
>>>>> could in bad situation save you from some harm, you chose to ride rather
>>>>> than walk, I don't lay blame.... but you should except responsibility
>>>>> for your actions.
>>>>
>>>> This adds to all our insurance & medical costs.
>>>
>>>
>>> NO, I'm fine with all my medical and insurance, no added costs.....
>>
>> You add to MINE.
>
>
>Name one time...
>
>it never happened.

See "insurance".

>>> They might lay in a hospital intensive care at age 86 and cost more so
>>> death now is minor. Besides insurance is for the other guy in car
>>> accidents, not for me, if it gets too expensive I quit driving.
>>
>> So said the last guy with tickets ....
>
>That might be another reason to stop driving but I still have my license
>and have never had it taken or suspended or had a ticket drive up my
>insurance costs. While that may be your incentive to not drive, I don't
>know about getting tickets or DUI since I don't and never did get those.
>I liked my safe driver discounts.

You protest too much.
And we all know wingers lie.
--
Cliff

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Rush to flee US
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/589453ba81b739ca?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 5:13 pm
From: Wes

Andrew VK3BFA <VK3BFA@wia.org.au> wrote:

>Well then, it should be fairly simple. If you can get enough people to
>support your views, they can, at the next election, vote for a
>candidate who represents their views. thats the democracy part. If
>they cant be bothered, then they have made a choice too.
>So Roger - start organising, see if you have enough support at the
>ballot box to implement your no doubt sincerely held views. Its your
>right as a citizen in a democracy. Otherwise, its just crap.
>Andrew VK3BFA.

Our system has a 2 year feed back loop. It is the House of Representatives. They are
elected every two years, can not be appointed, a vacancy requires a special election out
of time of the general election schedule.

This is the populist part of the legislature. The Senate, that is elected every 6 years,
is the part that can take a longer view on things.

Six years is a long time in politics.

Wes

--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 5:14 pm
From: Wes

"Ed Huntress" <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:

>The bigger problem is that they all have different ideas about what the word
>republic means, now, and what they think it meant to the Founders. Hamilton,
>Madison, and Jefferson all gave their definitions -- all of them different.
><g>

Hey Ed, do you ever consider the anti-federalists? Just wondering.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:52 pm
From: "Ed Huntress"

"Wes" <clutch@lycos.com> wrote in message
news:MKxpn.72359$Bs1.12428@en-nntp-01.dc1.easynews.com...
> "Ed Huntress" <huntres23@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>>The bigger problem is that they all have different ideas about what the
>>word
>>republic means, now, and what they think it meant to the Founders.
>>Hamilton,
>>Madison, and Jefferson all gave their definitions -- all of them
>>different.
>><g>
>
> Hey Ed, do you ever consider the anti-federalists? Just wondering.

In what sense, Wes? I've read all the anti-federalist papers, if that's what
you mean. That was most of what they left to posterity. You'll see other
arguments from anti-federalists in the transcripts of the state ratification
debates.

In the context of defining democracy and republic, there is no difference
between the federalists and anti-federalists. Democracy then meant direct,
face-to-face voting by the people on every issue. Of a republic, Jefferson
said, "It must be acknowledged that the term 'republic' is of very vague
application in every language... Were I to assign to this term a precise
and definite idea, I would say purely and simply it means a government by
its citizens in mass, acting directly and personally according to rules
established by the majority; and that every other government is more or less
republican in proportion as it has in its composition more or less of this
ingredient of direct action of the citizens."

That's all they meant by "republic." Although Hamilton, Madison, etc. worded
it differently, and Hamilton, particularly, had a rather broad idea of what
could be a republic, they all agreed on that point above, as stated by
Jefferson. There were no other restrictions. It did not require a
constitution. There were no rules for supermajorities, or for state- versus
individual representation, or anything else. Those were later additions to
their basic idea of what a republic is.

--
Ed Huntress

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Oil filter wrench
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/60ec5e63639fffb7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 5:13 pm
From: spambait@milmac.com (Doug Miller)

In article <ho62cg$94d$1@speranza.aioe.org>, "Steve W." <csr684@NOTyahoo.com> wrote:
>Doug Miller wrote:
>> In article <q3icq5djs7bnrrrjkldihgmoiu921cjh3k@4ax.com>,
> ljaques@diversify.invalid wrote:
>>> On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 15:48:14 -0700 (PDT), the infamous
>>> stans4@prolynx.com scrawled the following:
>>
>>>> Yeah, they're ALWAYS oiled up when I stick them in, doesn't always do
>>>> the trick. Sometimes the gasket sticks to the engine side when the
>>>> filter spins off, that's a lot of fun trying to peel off.
>>> Doublecheck your torque settings. You are likely overtightening the
>>> filter. Do it like a wheel bearing: crank it down (seating the gasket
>>> tightly in the oil filter), loosen it, then spin it up more lightly.
>>
>> I spin it on finger-tight, then grab it with my whole hand and give it 1/4
>> turn more. Never had one leak, and never had any trouble removing one either.
>
>You would think that some folks never read the direction printed on the
>box!!!
>
>99% of them either have it printed on the box or on the filter itself.
>Most say.
>Clean the filter base on the engine.
>Apply a thin layer of oil to the gasket.
>Tighten filter until the gasket seats.
>Tighten additional 3/4 turn.

Nope. Try again. I just checked the instructions on a Fram box. "Tighten 3/4
turn after gasket contacts base".

"Gasket contacts base" and "gasket seats" aren't the same thing.

"Gasket contacts base" + 3/4 turn, and finger-tight + 1/4 turn are, as near as
I can tell, about the same.
>
>Note that no wrench is involved.
>
>One thing that Fram does on their filters that I wish all the others
>would do it the textured coating the put on the filters.
>It does give you a better grip taking them off.

Makes it a lot easier to put one *on* with oily fingers, too.

>About the only time I need a wrench is when someone tightened the filter
>down with a wrench OR I can't get my hand onto the filter in a way that
>I can grip it tight.

If you *don't* need a wrench to take it off, you probably didn't put it on
tight enough by hand.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: WAY OT [OT] Speak Landscaper
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/489b2cc23aed5ac6?hl=en
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== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:18 pm
From: Winston

On 3/21/2010 9:40 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
> On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 21:23:56 -0700, the infamous Winston
> <Winston@bigbrother.net> scrawled the following:
>
>> On 3/20/2010 6:04 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
>>> On Fri, 19 Mar 2010 21:54:17 -0700, the infamous Winston
>>> <Winston@bigbrother.net> scrawled the following:
>>
>> (...)
>>
>>>> I zipped into the garage and snapped up the street valve
>>>> wrench. After shutting off the street valve, the
>>>> mini tsunami subsided at last.
>>>
>>> It's a good thing that you had one. Um, why DID you have one?
>>
>> Larry, I'm shocked. It is a tool, so why wouldn't I have one?
>
> Easy answer: Because you're not a landscaper or city Public Works
> "worker" (must use that term loosely around govvy jobs.)

Think of it as my only bow to Robert A. Heinlein.
WRT his famous 'specialization' quote.

(...)

> I'm going to rent one for myself some day. They're only $150 a day,
> so it's cheaper than a pair of fresh HD trabajadors, who might be able
> to do the same amount of work in one day.

Wear a respirator because the diesel variety get pretty unpleasant
pretty quickly. Also, have lots of clear area around because the
skid steers will snap offending fenceposts just like *that*.

>>> Well, at least it hasn't interrupted your Easter egg hunts...yet.
>>
>> Watch This Space.
>
> ohshit...

Yup.

--Winston

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:29 pm
From: Winston

On 3/21/2010 9:48 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
> On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 21:12:23 -0700, the infamous Winston
> <Winston@bigbrother.net> scrawled the following:
>
>> On 3/20/2010 6:00 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
>>
>> (...)
>>
>>> The feelings instantly lessened when I quit watching TV 3
>>> years ago.
>>
>> I want the patience and moral strength necessary to stop
>> watching television and I want them RIGHT NOW!
>>
>> :) :)
>
> Detoxing from TeeVee in 3 Easy Steps + 1:
>
> 1) Don't pay this month's cable bill.
>
> 2) Use dykes to snip coax cable at the wall.
>
> 3) Ask wifey (neighbor, friend, etc.) the way to your SHOP and go get
> some more projects done!
>
> 4) When you're tired from that, relax and read all the unfinished
> books on your bookshelf and wherever else you store them.
>
> When you're satisfied that you don't need TV any more, send me the
> equivalent amount of a year's cable payments for my consultation fee.
>
> P.S: Once you're away from TV for a month, ask your doctor to
> discontinue your high blood pressure medicine. He'll find that it's
> alright (maybe even _low_) now.

Yup. Reminds me of the Don Lancaster cartoon showing an appropriately
chubby fellow holding his TV power cord by the plug and snipping
it in two with properly - sized wire cutters. Wise then and wise now.

--Winston

==============================================================================
TOPIC: abuse@aioe.org
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/1493487475f041fc?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:24 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

Wes wrote:
>
> "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > They won't do anything. AIOE exists for trolls and kooks to abuse
> >Usenet. I went through the same thing a while back, and all I got was
> >smartassed replies from the owner. They will kill an account for using
> >your screen name & email address, but allow the offender to create a new
> >one, seconds later.
>
> If the user has a dynamic ip from their ISP, it would be impossible for AIOE to black list
> that person. Unless you are posting from inside a company or pay for a static public ip
> like I do, there is no way to tie a user to an ip.

My IP address is dynamic, yet it has only changed three times in over
five years.

You notice that AIOE hides the NNTP IP Posting Host address in their
headers?

--
Lead free solder is Belgium's version of 'Hold my beer and watch this!'

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:52 pm
From: Too_Many_Tools

On Mar 20, 8:04 pm, "Steve B" <deserttra...@dishymail.net> wrote:
> Path:
> Xl.tags.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.posted.broadwing2!news.posted.broadwing2.POSTED!not-for-mail
> Message-ID: <0ied77-a811.ln1@news.infowest.com>
> From: "Steve B" <deserttra...@fishymail.net>
> Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
> Subject: Re: bucky wire feed
> Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2010 16:39:14 -0700
> References: <4ba40287$0$65830$892e0abb@auth.newsreader.octanews.com>
> Lines: 22
> NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2010 18:40:04 -0500
> X-Priority: 3
> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5843
> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
> X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Response
> X-Usenet-Provider:http://www.giganews.com
> NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.17.177.190
> X-Trace:
> sv3-yFTJyMvRBbAT2Bf+cxzozk61zOMtpeLSVMwkzaoEhyNAARIN02wqRYusn6423WFuYodAW10vK/qd4+6!F/oCKItfrlFYHqMMfHEqCWPjTWoOOMny9/riRCYVpWjiaxjPuthWzvVJWzpMm+tSK6Wf9D5X/A==
> X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
> X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint
> properly
> X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
> Bytes: 1847
> Xref: news.infowest.com rec.crafts.metalworking:201679
>
> I seem to have a stalker writing into newsgroups claming to be me and
> posting profane things. Hope you can do something about this.

One way that does get results is when a poster posts threats...forward
the info to the FBI/SS/TSA/DHS.

More than one poster has disappeared after the Government has been
alerted to their threats.

And others are being monitored...and I assume ever increasing case
files are being built of thier activities.

And individuals are being held accountable for their postings...a
local smartass conservative is serving time for Internet harrassment
and from what I have heard a civil suit is likely to be filed to
recover damages.

The truth is that most idiot posters are not worth noting...and when
they leave this Earth their absence will not be missed.

TMT

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Speaking of aluminum cylinder bores...
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/0529ed0b59765e57?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:29 pm
From: Tim Wescott

dbr@kbrx.com wrote:
> Try Avery's removable labels. They hold well on many surfaces - Ackro
> style parts bins - floppies - labels on plastic (acrylic/something) cans.
> Sticking them to a desktop, scribbling a word or 2, removing with a knife
> blade and resticking to a container is possible.
>
> Hul

Y'know, I don't think this was a response to my post about aluminum
engine cylinders.

Somehow.

--
Tim Wescott
Control system and signal processing consulting
www.wescottdesign.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Al Gore takes aim
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/4e2ba8fcc22c79a4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:29 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

D Murphy wrote:
>
> Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
> news:stgbq5p1qd39p2b6vvrbkmp0bvjck6h3rk@4ax.com:
>
> > On 14 Mar 2010 05:29:18 GMT, D Murphy <dmurf154@att.net> wrote:
> >
> >>Cliff <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
> >>news:gi1op554e8sdf00oa7l67bn0i43lqpamul@4ax.com:
> >>
> >>> On Wed, 3 Mar 2010 15:32:31 -0800 (PST), "dcaster@krl.org"
> >>> <dcaster@krl.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>On Mar 3, 10:43 pm, Hawke <davesmith...@digitalpath.net> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Well, that depends on where you are. If it's San Francisco then
> >>>>> it's no big deal. If it's Dallas then it is. But what I am doing
> >>>>> is betting that when summer comes it's going to be just as hot or
> >>>>> hotter this year than it was last year. I think that is a pretty
> >>>>> safe bet.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hawke
> >>>>
> >>>>Maybe. I bet that this winter was going to be as warm or warmer
> >>>>than it was last year. It may have been a pretty safe bet, but this
> >>>>winter was colder. I think that the high for every day in Jan and
> >>>>Feb was below the average high for those dates. Still have snow on
> >>>>over 50% of the lawn.
> >>>>
> >>>> Dan
> >>>
> >>> So far, IIRC, this last winter is a record warm one for the US.
> >>
> >>
> http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/analysis_monitoring/lanina/enso_e
> >>v olution-status-fcsts-web.pdf
> >>
> >>HTH
> >
> > Up to 8 degrees C warmer you say?
>
> I never said that.
>
> > With Canada nearly balmy (for a Canadian winter)?
>
> http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2009/20091015_winteroutlook.html
>
> Shocking!
>
> > Think any polar ice or tundra will melt (more/sooner)?
>
> I would certainly hope so.
>
> >
> > http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2010/20100316_globalstats.html
> >
> > "The combined global land and ocean surface temperature for February
> > 2010 was
> > the sixth warmest on record,"
> >
> > "Warmer-than-average temperatures enveloped much of the rest of the
> > world's
> > land areas, with the warmest temperature anomalies occurring across
> > Alaska, Canada and across the Middle East and northern Africa. "
> >
> > "The February worldwide ocean temperature was the second warmest,
> > behind 1998,
> > on record."
> >
> > "Arctic sea ice covered an average of 5.6 million square miles (14.6
> > million
> > square kilometers) during February. This is 6.8 percent below the
> > 1979-2000 average extent and the fourth lowest February extent since
> > records began in 1979. This was also the 12th consecutive February
> > with below-average Arctic sea ice extent. February Arctic sea ice
> > extent has decreased by 2.9 percent per decade since 1979."
> >
> > Guess some cold airmoved South from Canada at one point, eh?
>
> Guess you missed this part from your link - "A moderate-to-strong El
> Niño continued in February. Sea surface temperatures across parts of the
> equatorial Pacific Ocean were more than 2.7 degrees F (1.5 degrees C)
> above average during the month. According to NOAA's Climate Prediction
> Center, El Niño is expected to continue at least through the Northern
> Hemisphere spring 2010."
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:El_Nino_regional_impacts.gif
>
> Effects of a normal weather cycle.

NOAA? The same NOAA that tripped my weather radio last night with an
'Avalanche Warning', in N. Central Florida?

--
Lead free solder is Belgium's version of 'Hold my beer and watch this!'

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:34 pm
From: Dawlish

On Mar 21, 10:16 pm, D Murphy <dmurf...@att.net> wrote:
> Dawlish <pjg...@hotmail.com> wrote innews:a6271a0e-bbf3-4db4-b1c1-789146286dec@33g2000yqj.googlegroups.com:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 21, 6:13 pm, D Murphy <dmurf...@att.net> wrote:
> >> Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote
> >> innews:k0ibq5lqkq7
> > m61t76ktf7shm1p97j9e...@4ax.com:
>
> >> > On 20 Mar 2010 05:20:57 GMT, D Murphy <dmurf...@att.net> wrote:
>
> >> >>Curly Surmudgeon <CurlySurmudg...@live.com> wrote in
> >> >>news:ho1h9c$vh4$7 @news.eternal-september.org:
>
> >> >>> On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 02:37:23 +0000, D Murphy <dmurf...@att.net>
> >> wrote:
>
> >> >>>> Gunner Asch <gunnera...@gmail.com> wrote in
> >> >>>>news:eak6q5tkh677j35fsmiocsh8nqom3fbvbq@4ax.com:
>
> >> >>>>> On 14 Mar 2010 05:29:18 GMT, D Murphy <dmurf...@att.net> wrote:
>
> >> >>>>>>olution-status-fcsts-web.pdf
>
> >> >>>>> Looks like 1998 was the hot year and its been getting cooler
> >> >>>>> ever since.
>
> >> >>>> Cliff isn't very good at math and has little understanding of
> >> >>science.
> >> >>>> It's funny how he will dismiss ten years of cooler temperatures
> >> >>>> as "weather" but cites an El Nino as a sign of impending global
> >> >>>> doom.
>
> >> >>> Untrue: http://
> >> >>>www.g2weather.com/.a/6a010535bea9f5970b010536311139970b-800wi
>
> >> >>Wow. I'm convinced. That nifty graph proves Cliff got better at
> >> >>math between 1950 and 2000.
>
> >> >>Or not.
>
> >> >>But seeing as it doesn't cover this winter, it probably doesn't
> >> support
> >> >>his claims.
>
> >> > Does not cover next year either.
> >> > So what?
>
> >> > But it does show that "ten years of cooler temperatures"
> >> > is a big winger lie. As usual & as expected.
>
> >>http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs/Fig.E.lrg.gif
>
> >> Feel free to point out the years warmer than '98.
>
> > 2005 (NASA) and the period May 2009 - March 2010 is warmer than the
> > same period in 1998 (and any other year). Jan-Dec years are very
> > arbitrary time periods and one year is far too short a period from
> > which to deduce anything to do with climate. Decades are better. The
> > last decade was significantly warmer than the 90s.
>
> >> Or maybe you could explain Phil Jones' statement that there's no
> >> statistically significant warming in the last 15 years.
>
> > Maybe you'd like to read the actual BBC interview?
>
> >http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8511670.stm
>
> > You have to understand a little about statistical significance to
> > understand this, of course, but there has been warning and it alnost
> > achieved 95% significance. That's what Phil Jones meant. The warming
> > was significant at >90%. I hope someone will now alter their sig to
> > say the truth. "Over the last 15 years, there has been warming at the
> > 90%+ significance level. Again, Phil Jones has also said the every
> > decade of the last century was warmer than the decade previous to it.
> > That longer timespan is a far better measure.
>
> >> While you're at it explain how warm El Nino winters are proof of
> >> whatever idiocy you were claiming about this past winter.
>
> > This has been a moderate El Nino. 1998, the "record year" that you
> > refer to, was the largest El Nino of the modern era. We presently have
> > an extended solar minimum, which we didn't then and the PDO is
> > negative (positive in 1998) Both of those are cooling factors.
> > Temperatures through this El NIno and despite the cooling factors are
> > roughly comparable to 1998. What does that tell you has happened to
> > the background world temperature?
>
> >> Dan- Hide quoted text -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -
>
> > Well?
>
> Well, you've taken this even further out of context, plus with Cliff's
> snipping out the relevent bits, it gets hard to follow. So here's the
> context: Cliff made a statement that this might be a record warm winter
> in the US. I post a link that shows ENSO data that concludes with
> evidence of the current El Nino, so you'd expect certain weather
> patterns. Cliff doesn't respond, likely because he doesn't get it. Later
> I make the observation how any data, such as the absence of a warming
> trend over the last ten years, that is counter to his beliefs is
> dismissed by him as weather. But when data shows that weather patterns
> like El Nino help explain the recent warm weather, he's silent. Then
> Curly posts a link to a Hadcrut graph of some unkown temperature series
> from 1950-2000 to show that the last ten years have in fact been warmer.
> Huh?
>
> Then Cliff jumps in with the brilliant observation that in order to
> disprove that the last ten years have been cooler years than 1998, you
> needn't look at the last ten years.
>
> So, there's nothing incorrect about anything I've posted so far. You
> seem to be making some unfounded assumptions into what I've written. I
> didn't post any conclusions, just observations.
>
> Take statistics for instance. In manufacturing we apply them in process
> control. So I have more than a passing familiarity with them, thank you
> very much. I've also read the interview with Jones and agree that it is
> often mischarecterized, but I don't see where I did that in the context
> of talking about the last ten years.
>
> To sum it all up, I posted ENSO data to show Cliff that you might expect
> the weather he posted about, and from that action, everyone assumes that
> they know what I think about AGW and jumps to conclusions that aren't
> there.
>
> --
>
> Dan- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Just helping you with your facts Dan.*>))

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Hook, line and rapture
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/e435b0dfbd3b6300?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:32 pm
From: "RogerN"

"Darrell Stec" <darstec@neo.rr.com> wrote in message
news:80ms75Far9U1@mid.individual.net...
> Cliff wrote:
>
>> http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=patcondell#p/u/30/HXdwcIWIB_o
>
> Wow. That guy can summarize and put religion in perspective.
>
> --
> Later,
> Darrell

For some reason my posts stopped showing up to the Cliffie cross-post
newsgroups so I'm resending to the one where I read the original post.

The guy is simply someone that wastes time and effort to make false
parallels and fools others to think he can "summarize and put religion in
perspective". His videos are easy to fool the ignorant but notice he
doesn't have anyone to argue with him and show that his BS is simply BS.
Christianity isn't based on the dream of a man, the idiot got that wrong as
almost everything else he said, proving the idiot is simply an idiot.

Another atheist might not be able to tell he is an idiot but from a
Christian perspective he got about everything wrong that he could possibly
get wrong. For one thing, the fool tries to base his BS on a "Prophecy"
from Pat Robertson, ignoring the many significant prophecies that did were
fulfilled. The Biblical way to tell a false prophet is that their
prophecies don't come true, Mr. Idiot doesn't understand.

RogerN

==============================================================================
TOPIC: If you are a homo, you likely are Too_Many_Tools.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/624674ca369cc2f7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:36 pm
From: Too_Many_Tools

On Mar 21, 5:05 am, "Chief Egalitarian" <Egal@legal_egal.law> wrote:
> "Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:5a160f86-933d-423f-92b2-ee9018c00bd4@k17g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Posted on Fri, Sep. 18, 2009
>
> not metal related doofus

Interesting how conservatives never post the truth...is it a genetic
condition that forces your type to lie?

TMT

The original post...

If you are a Conservative, you likely are a racist.

It it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, it likely is a racist
conservative.

Such sad little people need help...after being made harmless of
course.

TMT

There's no denying Obama's race plays a role in protests
Tony Pugh | McClatchy Newspapers
last updated: March 04, 2010 09:46:22 AM

WASHINGTON — In the pre-dawn hours of last Nov. 5, while much of the
nation celebrated Barack Obama's election as the nation's first black
president, three white men in Springfield, Mass., doused the
partially
completed Macedonia Church of God in Christ with gasoline and burned
it to the ground.

After their arrest, the men told police they'd torched the black
church because they were angry about Obama's election and feared
minorities would be given more rights.

At about the same time, newspaper Web sites were filled with millions
of hateful messages about Obama, and the computer servers of two
large
white supremacist groups, the Council of Conservative Citizens and
Stormfront.org, crashed because they got so much traffic.

"You immediately got the sense that something significant was
happening," said Mark Potok, who investigates hate groups as the
director of the Intelligence Project of the Southern Poverty Law
Center in Montgomery, Ala.

Potok's instincts were correct. Obama's victory had stirred immediate
racial anger among a small portion of Americans.

That visceral backlash quickly subsided, but as the grip of the worst
recession since the 1930s began to tighten, a different type of anger
began to surface. Only this time, the hostility wasn't limited to
society's fringe elements. It was everywhere.

The collapse of the housing market, the government bailout of Wall
Street, record job losses, long-term unemployment, trillion-dollar
deficits, shrinking retirement funds, growing government
intervention,
foreign economic competition and America's changing demographic
landscape left many Americans angry at the direction of the country,
confused about the source of their problems and fearful about the
future.

In this summer of discontent, much of that outrage, rightly or
wrongly, has been trained on President Obama. While it's an
occupational hazard that comes with the turf at 1600 Pennsylvania
Ave., some of the criticism of Obama has the unmistakable stench of
racism.

For example, a recent poster making the rounds shows Obama outfitted
in full African witch doctor gear, complete with headdress, above the
words "OBAMACARE coming to a clinic near you."

"I certainly detect a racial element in some of the hostility
directed
at President Obama," said Richard Alba, the distinguished professor
of
sociology at the Graduate Center of the City University of New York.
"I'm certain there are white Americans for whom having a dark-skinned
president in the White House is an enormous shock. This is really a
complete overturning of what they thought was the natural order of
things. The natural way that American society worked. It upsets all
their ideas about how American society is structured."

Potok agreed. "Anyone who's looked at some of the signs at the
various
'tea parties' knows perfectly well that race is a significant part of
this backlash," he said. " . . . I'm not suggesting that every person
angry about health care or immigration is a Klansman in disguise, but
at the back of this white-hot rage that we've been seeing are people
who are genuinely furious about the way the country is changing and
changing racially."

No one symbolizes the changing face of America more than Obama does.
"I think hundreds of thousands of whites are taking these very real
changes and attributing them to the race of the president," Potok
said.

Pollster Cliff Young of Ipsos said his research suggested that the
national anger, which, at least publicly, has been overwhelmingly
centered among whites, was about more than just race. He said a
"generalized fear of the unknown" was creating the tension.

Alba agreed, and said that Secretary of State Hillary Clinton
probably
would face similar hostility as president because she was a woman,
which would be another culture shock for many people.

"There's this tectonic shift going on in the United States, both
economically and demographically," Young said, noting that in 2042
non-
Hispanic whites are projected to become a racial minority. "And
certain segments of the population are feeling left out. Is what
we're
seeing directly a function of Obama's race? I think not, actually.
He's just an indicator of something 'different.' Of an America that's
not the same as what's idealized by certain segments of the
population."

Because racism is so personal and subjective, it's difficult to
quantify and doesn't show up neatly in surveys and polling data. Much
like pornography, racism is difficult to define, but most people
think
they know it when they see it or hear it. The problem is that
everyone
sees it differently based on experiences, biases and personal
beliefs.

Former President Jimmy Carter, however, reopened Pandora's box this
week by asserting that racism was a major factor behind the hostility
that Obama has faced. Carter gave a respected, white and Southern
voice to concerns that many had dismissed as the baseless whining of
overprotective blacks.

In doing so, the former Georgia peanut farmer helped set off another
round in America's 390-year-old debate about politics and race that
many would prefer to avoid.

In his new book, "In the President's Secret Service," author Ron
Kessler writes that racists and white supremacists probably account
for more than a third of the estimated 30 death threats that Obama
allegedly receives every day, about four times as many as were
directed at former President George W. Bush. The Secret Service
wouldn't confirm Kessler's claim.

Unlike Potok, however, Kessler said the citizen outrage expressed at
town hall meetings and tax protest events known as "tea parties"
didn't reflect racist sentiment. He disagrees with Carter's
assessment.

"I think it's reprehensible for (Carter) to attribute racial motives
to people who simply disagree with Barack Obama's policies," Kessler
said. "Quite a few of the threats are racially motivated, which
doesn't necessarily mean 'right wing.' It means they're racists. It
means they're white supremacists. They're jackasses, but it doesn't
necessarily mean they're politically tuned in to any particular
philosophy. I don't know how they vote, but they're not necessarily
involved in any political movement."

One of the first reactions to Carter's statement came from Republican
National Committee Chairman Michael Steele, who accused Carter of
playing the "race card."

Many, however, think that the Republican Party and its supporters,
particularly media personalities such as Rush Limbaugh and Glenn
Beck,
have used race most frequently and in the most inflammatory manner to
frame their opposition to and displeasure with the president.

"I don't think anybody has used the symbols of race and racism to
criticize this president more than the individuals on the right,"
said
D'Linell Finley, a political science professor at Auburn University
at
Montgomery. "Listen to the radio, look at the signs and listen to
their individual words. It comes through both in a subtle and not-so-
subtle manner."

The not-so-subtle incidents are numerous:

Last October, John McCain's campaign ousted a Buchanan County, Va.,
McCain campaign official, Bobby May, for writing a newspaper column
that said that if Obama were elected he'd hire rapper Ludacris to
paint the White House black and change the national anthem to the
"Negro National Anthem" by James Weldon Johnson.

Diane Fedele, who was then the president of a Republican women's club
in San Bernardino County, Calif., resigned last October after she
sent
out a newsletter with a drawing of Obama on a bogus food-stamp coupon
surrounded by ribs, watermelon and fried chicken.

In May, Sherri Goforth, an aide to Republican state Sen. Diane Black
of Tennessee, sent an e-mail to Republican staffers showing the first
43 U.S. presidents in stately poses, but Obama's image, as the 44th
president, was a pair of bright white cartoonish eyes on a black
background.

In June, Diann Jones, the vice chairman of the Collin County
Republican Party in Texas sent an e-mail to local Republican clubs
calling a proposal for a $50 gun tax "another terrific idea from the
black house and its minions."

Also in June, South Carolina Republican activist Rusty DePass
compared
an escaped gorilla from a Columbia zoo to first lady Michelle Obama's
ancestors.

At an August political forum, Republican U.S. Rep. Lynn Jenkins of
Kansas denied any racial intent when she said that the party was
looking for a "great white hope" to lead the party into the future.

David Bositis, a senior research associate at the Joint Center for
Political Studies, a public-policy research institute, said: "You
have
a whole bunch of incidents of that sort, and they're accelerating in
their occurrences."

To many, South Carolina Republican U.S. Rep. Joe Wilson's "You lie"
outburst was only the latest racially tinged episode involving the
party. Bositis said that much of the antagonism came from the
Southern
wing of the party, in part because Obama was the first Northern
Democratic president since Kennedy and because the Republican Party's
Southern clout had been marginalized.

"It has been a long time since they've had such a limited influence
in
the U.S. Congress," Bositis said. "A number of these people have gone
out of their way to diss Obama, and that's a Southern thing, it's not
a black thing. But what is it about Obama that they most want to
diss?
A lot of it has to do with his race."

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:40 pm
From: "Chief Egalitarian"

"Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_tools@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:86f261d2-34ef-4aea-8f89-075717922fc3@q21g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> On Mar 21, 5:05 am, "Chief Egalitarian" <Egal@legal_egal.law> wrote:
>> "Too_Many_Tools" <too_many_to...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:5a160f86-933d-423f-92b2-ee9018c00bd4@k17g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> > Posted on Fri, Sep. 18, 2009
>>
>> not metal related doofus
>
> Interesting how conservatives never post the truth...is it a genetic
> condition that forces your type to lie?
>
> TMT

Your two mommies' titanium dildos don't count as being on-topic you kook!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: labelling plastic parts bins
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/b20ea27b9e6c5356?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:36 pm
From: "Pete C."

Stu Fields wrote:
>
> I have a number of plastic parts bins purchased from Global. I want to put
> some adhesive backed computer generated labels on the bins. The labels peel
> off after about a week. Any ideas on what adhesive to use?? I've tried
> Elmers, hot glue and some acrylic. None of these seem to work. Global has
> said they don't know either>>>
>
> Stu Fields

There are P-Touch label carts available with heavy duty adhesive that
should stick just fine if you clean the surface with some alcohol before
applying the label.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Is Sarah Palin going bald?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/ea159f271de50845?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:37 pm
From: "Chief Egalitarian"

"Cliff" <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
news:id8dq5pddfsscforkkn67dna6kid57g4gt@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 21 Mar 2010 05:03:16 -0500, "Chief Egalitarian"
> <Egal@legal_egal.law>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Cliff" <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>>news:monbq5dpddvk0c89s1str7nbvcv50nrmvm@4ax.com...
>>> On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 10:34:17 -0500, "Chief Egalitarian"
>>> <Egal@legal_egal.law>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Aratzio" <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:n1m9q5d89rngei72tf1222qi2h9d5gfan1@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Sat, 20 Mar 2010 08:44:44 -0500, in the land of alt.usenet.kooks,
>>>>> "Chief Egalitarian" <Egal@legal_egal.law> got double secret probation
>>>>> for writing:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Cliff" <Clhuprichguesswhat@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:dtp8q51dus34sm0agj2s9kb518c5tsmjhv@4ax.com...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>No, you must have been looking at your daddy's ass again!
>>>>>
>>>>> First thing that comes to every wingnuts head, gay fantasies.
>>>>>
>>>>> This one has an extra special helping of wing nut family values thrown
>>>>> in for good measure.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Typical lib fag fantasy always thinking about someone else's nuts. With
>>>>extra ass looking thrown in for good measure.
>>>
>>> "extra ass" .... now he's after Coulter too !!
>>> --
>>> Cliff
>>
>>Nah, her ass is nice and lean,
>
> Thinking of Rush now?
>
>>like a good conservative woman. Not like
>>those porker liberal swine. When I say "extra ass", think on the scale of
>>Too_Many_Tools' fat ugly lesbo mommies doing each other on the hood of
>>their
>>Subaru. I'm going to go throw up now.
>
> Cost: Probably under US$ 1,000:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYhCn0jf46U&feature=related
>
> Palin cost over US$ 150,000 .....
> And who knows about your problems above.
> --
> Cliff

Palin is a natural beauty, a gift from God. Judged by her peers and beauty
contest judges, not just my opinion. There isn't a computer program on Earth
that could transform TMT's Moms into anything worth viewing. Nor are there
enough doves to cover their fat lard asses with dove shit.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:44 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

Chief Egalitarian wrote:
>
> Cliff wrote:
> >
> > Palin cost over US$ 150,000 .....
> > And who knows about your problems above.
>
> Palin is a natural beauty, a gift from God. Judged by her peers and beauty
> contest judges, not just my opinion. There isn't a computer program on Earth
> that could transform TMT's Moms into anything worth viewing. Nor are there
> enough doves to cover their fat lard asses with dove shit.

No, but they should be good for at least 1000 miles if they were
rendered into biodiesel.

--
Lead free solder is Belgium's version of 'Hold my beer and watch this!'

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Surface Plates
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/bc2625a5c4711576?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:41 pm
From: Cliff

On Sun, 21 Mar 2010 03:41:32 -0700 (PDT), Andrew VK3BFA <VK3BFA@wia.org.au>
wrote:

>On Mar 21, 7:16 pm, Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>
>wrote:
>> Surface Plates are often made of granite.
>> Why don't they make them from harder rock ?
>> --
>> Cliff
>
>Granite is a hard rock.

There are harder ones.
People used to "machine" granite with them, often by hand.

>Andrew VK3BFA.
--
Cliff

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:44 pm
From: Cliff

On Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:54:21 -0700 (PDT), "pdrahn@coinet.com"
<co_farmer@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Mar 21, 2:16 am, Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>
>wrote:
>> Surface Plates are often made of granite.
>> Why don't they make them from harder rock ?
>> --
>> Cliff
>
>Because there was already an ancient industry making flat granite for
>various monuments and buildings. Including grave monuments.
>
>Paul

They "machined" granite with harder rock for the Pyramids
& in Central America IIRC.
--
Cliff

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 5:06 pm
From: "Robert Swinney"

Paul sez:
"Because there was already an ancient industry making flat granite for
various monuments and buildings. Including grave monuments."

Close, but no cigar ! Nice observation but . . . . there is a vast amount of difference in the
precison required between making construction-grade granite and surface plates.

Bob Swinney

"pdrahn@coinet.com" <co_farmer@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3eb7eef7-7a36-4298-9d20-fbaf98390d95@n39g2000prj.googlegroups.com...
On Mar 21, 2:16 am, Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>
wrote:
> Surface Plates are often made of granite.
> Why don't they make them from harder rock ?
> --
> Cliff

Paul

==============================================================================
TOPIC: DIY surge protection...
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/fa560b93f2504a9b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:48 pm
From: Cliff

On Sun, 21 Mar 2010 04:05:11 -0700 (PDT), cncmillgil <milgil@cin.net> wrote:

>Could
>never get an answer as to why this happened. Knocked out a couple
>other surge strips including a plug in CO2 detector.

While I was staying in a motel in Southington, CT an
empty room burned.
Smoke detector started the fire. Melted & dripped flaming plastic
on the bed ....

(Had central wiring back to the office & was poorly
installed.)
--
Cliff

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:50 pm
From: Cliff

On Sun, 21 Mar 2010 05:20:14 -0700 (PDT), trader4@optonline.net wrote:

>That isn't correct. The main function of a surge protector is to
>shunt the current to ground.

Ground schmound.
The ground could be the hot wire.
Or not at all involved in the surge.
--
Cliff

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Bigger shaft (tap and die guide for tailstock)
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/d0e6d4e9fbc496be?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:53 pm
From: "Denis G."

On Mar 21, 3:45 pm, "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terr...@earthlink.net>
wrote:
> "Denis G." wrote:
>
> > On Mar 20, 3:46 pm, whit3rd <whit...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Mar 20, 10:00 am, "Denis G." <guill...@gis.net> wrote:
>
> > > > > > This doesn't answer your questions, but you might find this old
> > > > > > Popular Mechanics article useful to you:
> > > > I saw that. I loved reading those magazines when I was growing up.
> > > > There used to be a cartoon with a character that solved problems
> > > > around the house. He would scratch his head and come up with a clever
> > > > solution after a cloud with light bulb appeared over his head.
>
> > > Wordless Workshop (by Roy Doty (?))
>
> > Thanks! That was driving me crazy trying to remember the name of that
> > strip. I now see that it was a feature in Popular Science not Popular
> > Mechanics.
>
> Popular Science recently announced that all 137 years of their
> magazine are available online to read for free.
>
> http://www.popsci.com
>
> --
> Lead free solder is Belgium's version of 'Hold my beer and watch this!'- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Thanks Michael! An old flame that my wife won't mind me rekindling....

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The True Colours of Teabaggers
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.crafts.metalworking/t/e77fb546fe14b090?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Mar 21 2010 4:58 pm
From: Cliff

On 21 Mar 2010 21:21:05 GMT, D Murphy <dmurf154@att.net> wrote:

>Shall not be infringed <hot-ham-and-cheese@hotmail.com> wrote in
>news:f2002586-8cd3-4f40-ae62-6b23c1ba4e33@d37g2000yqn.googlegroups.com:
>
>> On Mar 21, 2:08 am, Cliff <Clhuprichguessw...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om>
>> wrote:
>>
>> "Colours"
>>
>> True Americans don't spell it with the "u."
>>
>> Where are you from, Cliffie? Why do you have such an interest in
>> things that are American?
>>
>>> http://www.kansascity.com/2010/03/20/1826688/congressmen-are-abused-
>b.
>>> .. [
>>> .... shouted obscenities at members of the Congressional Black Caucus
>>> and
>> spat
>>> on Rep. Emanuel Cleaver, a Missouri Democrat.
>>>
>>> The protesters used a racial epithet toward Rep. John Lewis, a
>>> Georgia De
>> mocrat,
>>> and confronted a gay congressman with taunts.
>>> ....
>>> A colleague who was accompanying Lewis said people in the crowd
>>> responded
>> by
>>> saying "Kill the bill," then the n-word.
>>> ....
>>> "It was a chorus," Cleaver said. "In a way, I feel sorry for those
>> people who
>>> are doing this nasty stuff — they're being whipped up. I decided I wo
>> uldn't be
>>> angry with any of them."
>>>
>>> Cleaver's office said later in a statement that he was also spat upon
>>> a
>> nd that
>>> Capitol Police had arrested his assailant.
>>> ....
>>> ]
>>>
>>> Can you spell "faux "news"" or "rethugs"?
>>> --
>>> Cliff
>>
>> I've been to a number of Tea Party events and haven't seen anything
>> like what you are claiming.
>
>It probably didn't happen -

Faux & Rush failed to report it?
--
Cliff

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Sunday, March 21, 2010

rec.crafts.metalworking - 25 new messages in 15 topics - digest

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